ETM and Mass Airflow Sensor Failure Symptoms and How to Replace MAF
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    1. #1
      Junior Member 1999s70's Avatar
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      ETM and Mass Airflow Sensor Failure Symptoms and How to Replace MAF

      As one who is on his 5th Electronic Throttle Module (ETM) and 4th Mass Air Flow Sensor (MAF), I’d like to write of my experience with these, in particular noting the symptoms of their impending failure (so that you don’t suddenly find yourself with a stalling car as an 18-wheeler barrels down on you from behind), and also telling you how to replace the MAF yourself and save lots of $$.

      The ETM issue is well-known among those lucky Volvo owners who have the 5-cylinder engine in models produced in 1999, 2000 and 2001. Like me . Volvo has extended the warranty on original throttle bodies, for up to 10 years or 200,000 miles, and that discussion has, I’m sure, been had many, many times and is beyond this post. In my experience, throttle bodies last around 70,000 to 90,000 miles, though I did get 118,000 out of my original one.

      Background:

      The air intake path, at least on a naturally aspirated (NA) engine, is as follows:

      Air Filter --> Mass Airflow Sensor (also called the Air Mass Meter, or MAF) --> Throttle Body --> Intake Manifold

      The throttle body contains a metal “throttle plate” that pivots along its diameter, allowing more or less air through. The car’s computer determines the plate’s position based upon, among other factors, engine speed and load, engine temperature, and accelerator pedal position. Within the throttle body is a “throttle position sensor” which, I understand, is nothing more than a strip of resistance film, over which the throttle place moves. Depending upon the location of the throttle plate’s edge, the electrical resistance through the sensor strip tells the computer the exact throttle plate position. Minor adjustments to this position are made by the MAF, which senses temperature and humidity. For example, hotter, more humid air has fewer oxygen molecules available for combustion (hot air less dense, oxygen displaced by water vapor), so the throttle plate opens slightly more than “normal” in this situation. If it did not, then you’d have less oxygen in the cylinders, which would either cause the engine to run “rich,” wasting fuel and possibly fouling spark plugs or catalytic converters, or the car’s computer would reduce the fuel charge into the cylinder, with a corresponding loss of power. More precisely, your car would perform noticeably different depending on temperature, humidity, altitude, etc.

      Eventually, after the throttle plate rubs over the throttle position sensor millions of times, the resistance film begins to deteriorate. As time goes on, the computer will be unable to determine the throttle plate’s position. My thought is that the MAF tries to compensate for some of the early throttle position sensor failure, and, in turn, it’s quite common for the MAF to fail shortly after the throttle. By “shortly after,” I’m talking, perhaps, 5,000 miles – much too long for most people to connect the failure of these two components – but, since I often drive that much in less than a month, and have had these components fail several times, the connection has been more than obvious to me. As for the throttle position sensor itself – my experience has been that the throttle body will last longer if you drive a variety of speeds, and it lasts the shortest time if you, for example, do the vast majority of your driving at, say, highway speed (minor fluctuations, rubbing the throttle position sensor, all happen at the same place on the resistance film).

      Symptoms of ETM and MAF failure:

      By the time the ETS light comes on your dashboard, and the car goes into “limp home mode,” the throttle has totally failed, though turning off the engine and restarting it will often clear the ETS light and enable you to drive normally for a short time.

      But, here are the earliest symptoms of ETM failure, most of which would probably go unnoticed:

      1. The earliest symptom happens in this circumstance – after driving steadily for a while at highway speeds, you come off the highway and have a series of stops – at traffic lights, or whatever – each time, the engine speed will drop noticeably below the 900 rpm idle speed, then come back up to 900, with an ever-so-slight surge. The feel is almost as if your transmission is downshifting from second to first gear too late. A normal throttle will not do this – if you watch your tachometer as you slow down, your engine speed will almost never go significantly below idle speed. Also note that the original idle speed for these engines was 850 rpm – this was increased by 50 rpm during one of the earlier “throttle software upgrades” – which has the effect of masking this particular symptom, at least for a while. My experience is that, once a throttle starts doing this consistently, though it can be intermittent, the throttle has around 25,000 miles left on it.

      Later in this stage of deterioration, you’ll also notice that your engine speed drops too low when coasting at moderate or highway speed. For example, normally my tach will read around 1500 rpm when I’m coasting at 40 mph. When the throttle starts acting up, my tach will read as low as 1000 or 1100 rpm while coasting at 40 mph, though the engine is in no danger of stalling. This symptom is also intermittent.

      2. The next symptom is “hunting at idle.” This means that, when you experience symptom #1 above, but are now stopped at, say, a traffic light, you’ll sometimes see the idle speed fluctuate slightly. Again, a normal throttle, with a warm engine, will not do this. Here, the feel is like, say, the a/c compressor is cutting in and out, which often momentarily raises or lowers the engine’s speed. But – the throttle symptom will happen even when the a/c is shut off. You will not be able to create the hunting situation at this phase of failure, though you will be able to induce it later.

      3. Eventually, you’ll feel momentary hesitation when driving at highway speeds, almost as if there’s a gust of wind pushing the car back. When this happens, I look at shrubbery to see whether there is a significant wind – and, if there isn’t, then it’s likely to be the throttle, especially if it has lots of miles on it. At this stage, the car is in no danger of stalling, but it’s one of the last signs that you’re getting close to a true failure – figure 5 to 10 thousand miles remaining on the throttle.

      4. When the throttle actually starts “failing,” you’ll feel a significant jerking motion as the engine tries to stall, often at highway speeds. Stepping on the accelerator pedal will, momentarily, do nothing. This can be quite unnerving to the uninitiated driver, or for passengers. However – you CAN get out of a potentially bad situation, merely by manually shifting the transmission down one gear – this increases the engine speed, which means that the throttle plate will now open to a place where the throttle position sensor is not as badly worn, and the hesitation episode will be over. You can upshift and chances are that the throttle will not fail again at that point – though you’re now on borrowed time, and a complete failure can happen at any time. Once the throttle has reached this point, hunting at idle will be very common, even with the engine cold, and the car may also be hard to start. It’s quite likely the there would be no codes stored in the car’s computer, although a failure to start may leave something behind.

      You will also be able to induce hunting at idle, especially if the car is warm – with the car stopped, one foot on the brake, and the transmission in drive (I’ve also had this work with the transmission in park, but I’ve found it’s more likely to happen with the transmission engaged), use your other foot to step on the accelerator to raise the engine speed to, say, 2000 rpm. A normal throttle will return the engine speed to 900 rpm in one smooth movement, with little or no overshoot. A failing throttle will often allow the engine speed to significant undershoot 900 rpm, then have the speed go well over 1000, drop well under 900, and continue to fluctuate with no further driver intervention – until the car stalls, or it settles in, sometimes with another tap on the accelerator. I have also had this happen spontaneously – once my car did a command performance on a test drive with a Volvo shop foreman as my passenger – needless to say, that scenario produced an automatic throttle replacement, no questions asked J .

      5. Failure of the MAF appears much like those of paragraphs 3 and 4, minus the hunting at idle – except that downshifting does absolutely nothing because the problem is not that you need to run the engine at a different speed to use a different portion of the throttle plate’s path, but that the throttle is getting faulty information from the MAF sensor. Also, MAF failure often presents itself as a staccato of multiple hesitations or attempts to stall, a fraction of a second apart, while ETM failure is often one such hesitation per episode. And MAF failure is more likely to show itself on extreme weather days, since the sensor would normally be providing the most correction to the ETM. Again, early failure often does not leave any codes in the car’s computer.


      What to do when the throttle starts failing?

      Once your ETM has started to fail significantly, meaning that you’re seeing symptoms from my paragraph 4, you have several options.

      First is that you can do nothing, living with the problem until the ETS light comes on. Murphy’s Law being what it is – this will happen when you’ve taken the car camping in a remote location, or when you’re sandwiched between two 18-wheelers at 70 mph, or you pull out to pass on a two-lane road, get to the oncoming traffic side and the car stalls when you step on the accelerator. Besides, stalling and hesitation ought not to be a way of life.

      Second is that you can take your car into a Volvo dealer. Note that the ETM must be replaced by a dealer – the actual mechanics of the replacement involve four bolts, a hose clamp and wiring connections, and probably take no more than 10 or 15 minutes – but software has to be loaded so that the new ETM is known to the ECU, and is properly “integrated” into the car’s electronics. If there are no error codes and no ETS light, often a dealer will either do nothing, or they’ll offer you a throttle body cleaning. I’ve heard both good and bad things about this service, though I’ve never had it done, myself. It’s also a DIY project, for those who care to try it. My opinion is – the cleaning, if done at a dealer, costs about $250 – a new throttle costs around $1000 – if the current throttle has at least ¼ of its life left in it, or you’re about to sell or trade the car, then it pays to do the cleaning. But – since throttle failure symptoms made you come into the dealer in the first place, while it’s quite possible that the cleaning may help for a short time, you’ll soon be back again, $250 poorer, facing a throttle replacement, anyway. But – Volvo will often resist replacing the throttle at this point, especially if it’s under warranty. The dealer will test drive the car, but without codes and/or an ETS light – if the car doesn’t do a “command performance” when being test driven, you will have to argue your point. If you have worked with a dealership that knows you and trusts your feedback on the car’s drivability, you may get your way.

      Sidebar – why should the throttle body need cleaning, in the first place? After all, it’s on the output side of the air filter – the throttle body should only be seeing filtered air. It turns out, however, that Volvo vents the crankcase fumes into the throttle body, so that they can go into the cylinders and be burned. Great for the environment; bad for the throttle. After a while, the throttle will have an accumulation of gunk that probably should be cleaned – but this will, more than likely, have no impact on the deterioration of the throttle position sensor resistance strip. And – I’ve also heard of dealers who offer throttle cleaning as a way to postpone throttle replacement until after a warranty expires, so that they don’t have to replace the throttle for free.


      Replacing the MAF sensor

      As I’ve mentioned, my experience (and that of several dealers to whom I’ve mentioned this) is that the MAF sensor often fails shortly after the ETM. Fortunately, this is a very simple DIY fix that requires a new MAF sensor (available at a nice discount from FCP Groton, for example), a 10 mm socket, a screwdriver and about 5 minutes of your time.

      1. Locate the MAF – it’s inserted into to the output side of the air filter housing. It’s held in by two 10 mm hex head screws, and has a large diameter air hose clamped on to its output – this hose goes to the throttle body. The MAF sensor also has a wiring connection on it.

      2. Disconnect the wiring connector – there’s only one way that it can be reattached, so don’t worry about keeping its orientation.

      3. Locate the hose clamp’s screw and loosen it a few turns – enough to slide off the hose.

      4. Loosen the two 10 mm screws holding the MAF and remove them – don’t drop them into the engine, making a 5 minute repair take an hour while you look for them .

      5. Pull the MAF sensor out of the air cleaner housing – it’s simply pushed into it and held in place by its rubber gasket. Gently twisting the MAF, or rotating it, may help. If you want, you can take off the air cleaner housing top and pull out the MAF with the air cleaner housing off the car.

      Installation of your new MAF sensor is the reverse of removal.

      I keep a spare MAF sensor in my garage – now, when an ETM gets replaced, I go home and replace the MAF sensor that day, then order another one when I can get a good deal on price, free shipping, etc. on a replacement spare.

      I do hope that this post helps identify failing throttles and MAF sensors, and saves someone from driving a car with a potentially dangerous situation. It can also give you advance warning of an upcoming maintenance expense if your throttle needs to be replaced outside of warranty.

      Please feel free to add your experiences to this thread, especially any other early failure symptoms. I'm hardly a "Volvo Expert" - just someone who's been through the ETM and MAF replacement process a few times.

      Best regards,
      George

      1999 S70, Pewter, Non-Turbo, Auto Tranny, 530K miles, Original Owner, XemodeX ETM
      I'm not the fastest off the line, but if the race lasts a million miles I just might win.

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    3. #2
      Member 1999_V70's Avatar
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      GREAT post George.

      This should DEFINITELY be put in the sticky on top.

      2013 Volvo S60 T5 Premier
      Caspian Blue / Beechwood

    4. #3
      Member 1999_V70's Avatar
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      Re: (895meztz94)

      BTW, I'm having #1 and #3 right now.

      I didn't know for sure before reading this what the hell was going on, but now I know.

      I'm out of warranty, like you. I've seen new throttles on Volvo part websites for ~$600. Could I buy that and just have Volvo download the new software? I'm assuming yes.

      Damn, this sucks. (For lack of a less blunt way to state things)

      With that out of the way, my plan would be this:

      Purchase this ETM, which I think is reasonably priced: http://www.eeuroparts.com/Main...44347

      Bring it to the dealer in my area with the most reasonable prices (Langhorne or Keystone) and have them install it and download the software update.

      George, would you happen to know how much the software itself is?

      2013 Volvo S60 T5 Premier
      Caspian Blue / Beechwood

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    6. #4
      Member 1999_V70's Avatar
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      Re: (895meztz94)

      One more thing to add-

      It has been my experience that symptom #1, found in George's diagnoses outline above, is more noticeable in cool to cold weather. Whether that has something to do with the Mass Airflow Sensor or the ETM itself, I do not know at this time. It's most likely that both are contributing to the problem.

      P.S - I cannot get over how informative this thread is on this particular issue.

      2013 Volvo S60 T5 Premier
      Caspian Blue / Beechwood

    7. #5
      Junior Member 1999s70's Avatar
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      Re: (895meztz94)

      Hi Chris,

      Thanks for your comments . My hope is to share my experience with others who, now informed, might be able to avoid a "limp home" situation, or worse, by attending to a failing throttle before a total failure. For that matter, to know that you may be able to, momentarily, get out of a bad situation by downshifting - it's worked for me on several occasions.

      As for purchasing a throttle... if you have a dealer or Indy shop who's willing to let you bring your own ETM and install it for you (they're going to be giving up their profit on the part, of course), then, by all means, you'll save quite a bit of $$, and you'll quite possibly have the replacement in much less time that Volvo could order the part for you. My understanding is that there's apparently somewhat of a "throttle shortage" at the moment - coupled with Volvo's current policy that dealers are basically unable to stock ETMs - they have to order throttles as necessary. So if you're at the back of the queue, you can wait a few weeks (!) for a new module.

      At the risk of giving away my "secret source of supply" - Volvo of Richardson, TX (a.k.a. MySwedishParts.net) sells ETMs for a few hundred dollars below the dealer list price - and they can overnight it to you if you're willing to pay for it (about $40). Get the throttle body gasket, too, while you're at it - a few dollars. And if you want the MAF - FCP of Groton, CT sells them for around $200 (a very nice discount off the dealer's list price which was over $250 about two years ago). I believe that they offer free UPS ground shipping on orders over $150, so you can stock up on anything else (filters, plugs, etc.) you need at the same time and save shipping costs. FCP of Groton is so close to me that I often get their packages the next day.

      The software load is not much - I don't recall, offhand, but it's in the $50 to $100 range. Also - actually replacing the throttle is not a big job at all - as I see it, 4 bolts, a wiring connection and a hose clamp. If you go to your regular dealer and you're a good customer, VCOA member, etc., you might ask to negotiate a better deal than the standard "couple of hours" for an ETM replacment, given that there's no diagnostic time to be spent. Or, especially since you're out of warranty, you might go to an Indy shop and see what they'll charge to install your part and load software.

      Best regards,
      George

      1999 S70, Pewter, Non-Turbo, Auto Tranny, 530K miles, Original Owner, XemodeX ETM
      I'm not the fastest off the line, but if the race lasts a million miles I just might win.

    8. #6
      Member 1999_V70's Avatar
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      Re: (1999s70)

      Quote, originally posted by 1999s70 »
      Hi Chris,

      Thanks for your comments . My hope is to share my experience with others who, now informed, might be able to avoid a "limp home" situation, or worse, by attending to a failing throttle before a total failure. For that matter, to know that you may be able to, momentarily, get out of a bad situation by downshifting - it's worked for me on several occasions.

      As for purchasing a throttle... if you have a dealer or Indy shop who's willing to let you bring your own ETM and install it for you (they're going to be giving up their profit on the part, of course), then, by all means, you'll save quite a bit of $$, and you'll quite possibly have the replacement in much less time that Volvo could order the part for you. My understanding is that there's apparently somewhat of a "throttle shortage" at the moment - coupled with Volvo's current policy that dealers are basically unable to stock ETMs - they have to order throttles as necessary. So if you're at the back of the queue, you can wait a few weeks (!) for a new module.

      At the risk of giving away my "secret source of supply" - Volvo of Richardson, TX (a.k.a. MySwedishParts.net) sells ETMs for a few hundred dollars below the dealer list price - and they can overnight it to you if you're willing to pay for it (about $40). Get the throttle body gasket, too, while you're at it - a few dollars. And if you want the MAF - FCP of Groton, CT sells them for around $200 (a very nice discount off the dealer's list price which was over $250 about two years ago). I believe that they offer free UPS ground shipping on orders over $150, so you can stock up on anything else (filters, plugs, etc.) you need at the same time and save shipping costs. FCP of Groton is so close to me that I often get their packages the next day.

      The software load is not much - I don't recall, offhand, but it's in the $50 to $100 range. Also - actually replacing the throttle is not a big job at all - as I see it, 4 bolts, a wiring connection and a hose clamp. If you go to your regular dealer and you're a good customer, VCOA member, etc., you might ask to negotiate a better deal than the standard "couple of hours" for an ETM replacment, given that there's no diagnostic time to be spent. Or, especially since you're out of warranty, you might go to an Indy shop and see what they'll charge to install your part and load software.

      Thanks for the information George.

      I actually have a GREAT Swedish mechanic which I would like to have perform the replacement, but he does not have the VADIS computer system. He does have the $2500 Tech 2 device for my Saab, but that's another subject.

      So I guess I need to find a dealer willing to work with me on these issues, and since my car has a service history at Langhorne since it was new, I think that they will work with me.

      Great to hear the software is relatively inexpensive though!

      2013 Volvo S60 T5 Premier
      Caspian Blue / Beechwood

    9. #7
      Junior Member 1999s70's Avatar
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      Re: (895meztz94)

      Hi Chris,

      If you're a member of the VCOA, check the back of Rolling and see if there's a dealer near you that offers discounts for VCOA members. At least they're potentially "VCOA-friendly." Perhaps the VCOA website itself will list these dealers, as well (www.vcoa.org).

      But, don't forget, of course, that you're asking a dealer to forego their parts profit - I was quoted a list price, before discounts, of about $780 for the ETM part in September - meantime, Volvo of Richardson's internet price was $551 (and I'm sure that they're making a profit, even at that price). That markup is probably 2/3, or more, of the total profit in the replacement, given their profit on a couple hours of labor, plus the software load. Don't be surprised if some dealers are, let's say, unenthusiastic about doing this.

      Also - for an Indy suggestion - you can try Jim Fanizzi in Red Bank, NJ (VoVo Clinic) which is probably not terribly close to you, but could be worth the trip if he's the nearest option - I guess you'd take I-78 to the Garden State, then south to Exit 110, if memory serves. I don't know if he can replace a throttle, but he's done other work for me and he's highly regarded by a number of people on this website.

      Best regards,
      George

      1999 S70, Pewter, Non-Turbo, Auto Tranny, 530K miles, Original Owner, XemodeX ETM
      I'm not the fastest off the line, but if the race lasts a million miles I just might win.

    10. #8
      Senior Member JRL's Avatar
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      Re: (1999s70)

      Dougherty automotive (in West Chester) has Vadis/Vida
      Email: jrl1194(at)aol.com
      If the subject is car purchase related please use jrl1194(at)gmail.com
      2007 V70 2.5T White/Oak 108K miles, new daily driver
      2000 V70R wife's. Won't sell, now near 141,000 miles and still near perfect!
      2000 S70 GLT SE 30,005 MILES, A time capsule! JUST SOLD.

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      Re: (JRL)

      Quote, originally posted by JRL »
      Dougherty automotive (in West Chester) has Vadis/Vida

      Really? Can you give me their number?

      Have you used them before?

      2013 Volvo S60 T5 Premier
      Caspian Blue / Beechwood

    12. #10
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      Re: (1999s70)

      Quote, originally posted by 1999s70 »
      Hi Chris,

      Also - for an Indy suggestion - you can try Jim Fanizzi in Red Bank, NJ (VoVo Clinic) which is probably not terribly close to you, but could be worth the trip if he's the nearest option - I guess you'd take I-78 to the Garden State, then south to Exit 110, if memory serves. I don't know if he can replace a throttle, but he's done other work for me and he's highly regarded by a number of people on this website.

      Thanks, do you have a number?

      2013 Volvo S60 T5 Premier
      Caspian Blue / Beechwood

    13. #11
      Senior Member JRL's Avatar
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      Re: (895meztz94)

      I didn't know that 19 year olds were so damn lazy, this took me 20 seconds to find.
      http://www.vovoclinic.com/
      Email: jrl1194(at)aol.com
      If the subject is car purchase related please use jrl1194(at)gmail.com
      2007 V70 2.5T White/Oak 108K miles, new daily driver
      2000 V70R wife's. Won't sell, now near 141,000 miles and still near perfect!
      2000 S70 GLT SE 30,005 MILES, A time capsule! JUST SOLD.

    14. #12
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      Re: (JRL)

      Quote, originally posted by JRL »
      I didn't know that 19 year olds were so damn lazy, this took me 20 seconds to find.
      http://www.vovoclinic.com/

      Thanks Jim.

      2013 Volvo S60 T5 Premier
      Caspian Blue / Beechwood

    15. #13

      Re: ETM and Mass Airflow Sensor Failure Symptoms and How to Replace MAF (1999s70)

      Thanks for the info, George. So far you and Don at...

      http://vexedvolvo.org/

      ...have been a wealth of information and strategy I find myself arming with to go forth on an adventure I neither want to or look forward to having.

      I was wondering if you have any information or stories, or know of a source of regarding the following...

      •Confirming absolutely the reality of the 200,000 mile/10 year warranty on the ETM.
      •Any experiences or tips on getting it honored.
      •Any other information regarding problems with this repair.

      I've owned my 1999 V70 base model for about a month (upgraded from a 740 GLE with 380,000 miles), have loved every minute of it till this morning, and now am in the wormhole of this special problem...here, hopefully in brief, is what happened, if it helps clarify any direction towards information that yourself or someone might offer.

      1999 V70, 149K, Vg to Exc condition, owned by me for a month, no problems of any kind except a dashboard squeak....weekend trips (300 miles) and around town driving and an 1800 mile New England trip, all pleasurable, without incident and great gas mileage. I carfaxed the car before buying, no issues, and contacted the place that did most of the maintenance on the car (Paul's Volvo, NJ) and they said that all the "recall updates" had been done. At the time I hadn't researched or known about the chronic ETM failure problem so I took their good natured information release at face value as a good sign and drove on.

      This morning, started the car up, instantly, as usual, and the girlfriend and I drive about 10 miles to local diner for breakfast (ironically, before heading to a local indy Volvo shop to check out a 1998 V70 for her!) After breakfast, start up the car, it's chugging, idling erratically, sounding like it's missing on a cylinder or something....hoping it is only flooded I drive off and it chugs and spurts up to about 30MPH, won't go any faster and doesn't react to accelerator pressure. We get down the road to the shop, and while we take the '98 for a ride the tech agrees to look at it and see what's up. When we return he is about to hook the car up to the diagnosis jack with his laptop, and lets me watch the process. Everything checks out OK, except for 4 different service or failure readings on the ETM. He says he is 90% sure it's the "throttle housing" that needs to be replaced...(he's not my regular mechanic, but does service many of the Volvo's in a particularly Volvo-rich area in the Hudson Valley in NY). He then briefly explains to me the problem, how it happens a lot, that "there might be a warranty but my car being around 150K might not be eligible" and that a new one installed will be around 800 bucks, and I could try and find a used or salvaged one to save money if I was so inclined.

      Then I get home (LIMP HOME), get on the internet, find this thread, the vexedvolvo site, along with other stories, at least it all seems predictable, though depressing. The honeymoon is threatening to be over way too soon.

      What I'm wondering, if you might know, is.....

      •Is this warranty myth or real, and where does one look for official confirmation it exists and is in effect?

      •What is the best course of action to find out if my 1999 Volvo V70 is eligible still for this warranty, and for how long, exactly?

      •What is the proper course of action for not only getting this warranty service, but navigating the possibility of a Volvo dealership trying to dissuade me from doing it or outright refusing?

      •Any other tips, experiences, strategies or attempts that have worked, haven't worked...that shed light on how to get my car running again, satisfactorily, and for the least (or no) outlay of lots of money to repair what seems to be a defect in the design of this part by Volvo.

      Thanks for any and all help, Mark


    16. #14
      Member 1999_V70's Avatar
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      DO NOT WORRY!

      The warranty is VERY VERY real. It was a huge class action.

      Take it to your Volvo dealer and let them take care of it free of charge!

      It's a 10 year 200k mile warranty.

      2013 Volvo S60 T5 Premier
      Caspian Blue / Beechwood

    17. #15
      Member MadeInJapan's Avatar
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      Premature not to worry....of course the warranty is real, but like the original poster, your '99 V70 may have been placed in service before this date in 1998, thus it may have surpassed the warranty date of 10 years already.
      '98 S70 T5 Emerald Green IPD and other Upgrades/ '07 S40 T5 M-66 MT Mystic Silver Metallic, Heico Sports Suspension & Cone Air Filter, OZ 18" Wheels, Elevate Dual Exhaust Intake Manifold BOV & Stage 1 Tune, 27mm Racing Beat Rear Sway, Proforged Rear End Links, Ultra Racing Strut Tower brace & E-Focus Mount/ '04 V70 2.5T Ruby Red - IPD Upgrades (wife's car)/ '07 S60 2.5T Barrent Blue (son's car) All: Mobil-1 synthetic @ 5K miles.

    18. #16

      Re: (MadeInJapan)

      Here is some info on my vehicle, what do you think this says in terms of terms of the possibility of getting warranty service if I get the car in to a dealer on Monday, 12/15/2008?

      12/02/1998 - US Customs - Vehicle exported from Belgium and imported to Newark, NJ

      02/05/1999 - Title issued or updated. First owner reported. Registered as personal vehicle.

      I would think that this would mean that the car is eligible for the warranty work until February 5th, 2009, does this sound right?


    19. #17
      Senior Member JRL's Avatar
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      Re: ETM and Mass Airflow Sensor Failure Symptoms and How to Replace MAF (mspencer)

      Of course the warranty is real, why would you think it wouldn't be?
      Email: jrl1194(at)aol.com
      If the subject is car purchase related please use jrl1194(at)gmail.com
      2007 V70 2.5T White/Oak 108K miles, new daily driver
      2000 V70R wife's. Won't sell, now near 141,000 miles and still near perfect!
      2000 S70 GLT SE 30,005 MILES, A time capsule! JUST SOLD.

    20. #18
      Member 1999_V70's Avatar
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      Re: (mspencer)

      Quote, originally posted by mspencer »

      I would think that this would mean that the car is eligible for the warranty work until February 5th, 2009, does this sound right?

      Yes, now stop asking all these questions and get your ass to a Volvo dealership.

      2013 Volvo S60 T5 Premier
      Caspian Blue / Beechwood

    21. #19
      Senior Member JRL's Avatar
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      Re: (mspencer)

      Quote, originally posted by mspencer »

      I would think that this would mean that the car is eligible for the warranty work until February 5th, 2009, does this sound right?


      Sounds about right, but Volvo dealers are about OUT of ETM's so get it in NOW so they can scrounge around for one or order one, the odds of them having one in stock is slim!
      Email: jrl1194(at)aol.com
      If the subject is car purchase related please use jrl1194(at)gmail.com
      2007 V70 2.5T White/Oak 108K miles, new daily driver
      2000 V70R wife's. Won't sell, now near 141,000 miles and still near perfect!
      2000 S70 GLT SE 30,005 MILES, A time capsule! JUST SOLD.

    22. #20

      Re: (1999_V70)

      It happened Saturday at 10 AM. The local Volvo dealerships' service dept. is only open weekdays. believe me, I'll be there at 7:25 at their door armed with coffee and insistence.

      Trying to get some thing fixed under a warranty like this, c'mon, you can NEVER ask enough questions beforehand, it's like going to the DMV, bring every f***ing document you have...who wants to be sent packing because they didn't ask enough questions or didn't bring the right documentation?

      I'd still like to see an official Volvo representation of the warranty, something I could print and bring along....but I appreciate all the knowledge about this I've found here and will post the outcome of my repair and how it goes down if anyone's interested.

      thanks, m.


    23. #21
      Senior Member JRL's Avatar
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      Re: (mspencer)

      I believe if you go to Don's site, "VEXED" on Matthewsvolvosite.com you should find it.
      The problem is now twofold, for the past 6 months to a year, Volvo has become stubborn and brought the hammer down on dealers, they need to get the OK from Volvo-NA before they just install a new one like that.

      During the 1st year of the recall the dealers would just replace it, no questions.
      If you had replpaced one prior to that, all you needed to do was send in your receipt and you received a check back for whatever you paid for one, even sales tax, but after a hundred thousand or so ETM's were installed or reimbursed, Volvo pulled the "easy plug" it became very expensive for them (do the math)! Bottom line, if your car is not exibiting the ETS light, you will have to show proof of it not driving properly.
      If it's driving well again when you bring it in, you will have trouble getting one authorized.

      That, combined with the fact (as I said above), the dealers are now plain OUT of ETM's, so hopefully your dealer will have one in stock.

      You really don't need any documentation, believe me, each and every dealer knows all about it, some are just easier to deal with than others.

      Email: jrl1194(at)aol.com
      If the subject is car purchase related please use jrl1194(at)gmail.com
      2007 V70 2.5T White/Oak 108K miles, new daily driver
      2000 V70R wife's. Won't sell, now near 141,000 miles and still near perfect!
      2000 S70 GLT SE 30,005 MILES, A time capsule! JUST SOLD.

    24. #22

      Success

      Got in to Hudson Valley Volvo at 7:30 AM, and after a lengthy wait for authorization they changed it out for free. Drove away around 1:30 PM after doing some serious snoring in the waiting room, I'll wager. Honeymoon resumed, thanks for putting up with me, everything worked out great. i even found out that by their reckoning the warranty on it is good till May 2010.

      I think they just changed it out right away, and didn't go through any lengthy Volvo-prescribed explorations before doing it. Took about 5 hours for authorization, tho.

      m.


    25. #23
      Senior Member JRL's Avatar
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      Re: Success (mspencer)

      Good show.
      I wish you had said where you were going, I want to know how many (throttle bodies) they have in stock
      Email: jrl1194(at)aol.com
      If the subject is car purchase related please use jrl1194(at)gmail.com
      2007 V70 2.5T White/Oak 108K miles, new daily driver
      2000 V70R wife's. Won't sell, now near 141,000 miles and still near perfect!
      2000 S70 GLT SE 30,005 MILES, A time capsule! JUST SOLD.

    26. #24
      Member 1999_V70's Avatar
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      Re: Success (JRL)

      That's great to hear!
      2013 Volvo S60 T5 Premier
      Caspian Blue / Beechwood

    27. #25

      Re: Success (JRL)

      When I brought the car in I told the gal behind the service counter that I was pretty sure I had a bad throttle, that I had had it checked at another mechanic and it was giving the failure codes (which I did/it was), that the previous service guy had reset the warning lights but they were showing again (they were) and that it was running in "Limp Home" mode. She didn't flinch, sounds like maybe she'd heard it before, and immediately came back with something like "they have to take it in and make sure it's giving them the codes and then we'll have to ORDER the part". So, the very beginning of the service visit sounded like maybe it was gonna be a drag. But, 20 minutes later another more in-charge woman came out and told me I was going to need a new throttle, that the old one was bad, that it WOULD be covered under the warranty and that the had it in stock, thank God (her words). She said they'd do it right now....but first just had to get authorization from Volvo Headquarters. the right now took over 4 hours, but it was worth it. I found out it's easier to sleep sitting up if you zip up the collar on a polar tek sweater, it kinda holds your head in place so you can get some z's without the head flop.

    28. #26
      Junior Member 1999s70's Avatar
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      Re: Success (mspencer)

      I'm glad that you got your new throttle.

      Be aware that you may be on borrowed time with the MAF failing. Apparently, when the throttle initially starts failing, the MAF tries to compensate for the mispositioning of the throttle plate, and, in turn, it usually fails, too. My experience has been that it fails within a couple of thousand miles of the throttle.

      I drive so much that two thousand miles can be well under two weeks for me - so I noticed the connection and asked around. Sure enough, there is a connection between these two components' failures, though one would normally never notice it.

      MAF failure given symptoms similar to those of the throttle, though downshifting has no effect. Sometimes you'll get a pulsing effect of multiple stalling attempts. And the cold days that we're having now will exaggerate the symptoms.

      Unfortunately, the MAF is not covered by the ETM warranty. The good news is that it's not terribly expensive and takes 5 or 10 minutes to replace yourself. My suggestion would be - especially if you're a DIY person - to order the MAF from FCP Groton - costs something like $180 at last check with free shipping (and you're in Brooklyn so, if you order it in the morning, you'll probably get it the next day, too) - and have it on hand. The only tools you'll need are a 10mm socket and a screwdriver. If Volvo changes it for you, they'll charge you full list on the part (around $250) and a decent fraction of an hour's labor.

      Personally - I keep a spare MAF in my garage at all times - when my throttle gets replaced, I go home and change the MAF that same day - even if it hasn't failed, yet, I'm confident that it would have, shortly - so I avoid the problem.

      Good luck!!

      Best regards,
      George

      1999 S70, Pewter, Non-Turbo, Auto Tranny, 530K miles, Original Owner, XemodeX ETM
      I'm not the fastest off the line, but if the race lasts a million miles I just might win.

    29. #27

      Re: Success (1999s70)

      How does this one look....?

      http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...ories


    30. #28
      Senior Member JRL's Avatar
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      Re: Success (mspencer)

      Quote, originally posted by mspencer »
      How does this one look....?

      http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors...ories


      It SAYS it's for an S80 or didn't you bother to scroll down
      Email: jrl1194(at)aol.com
      If the subject is car purchase related please use jrl1194(at)gmail.com
      2007 V70 2.5T White/Oak 108K miles, new daily driver
      2000 V70R wife's. Won't sell, now near 141,000 miles and still near perfect!
      2000 S70 GLT SE 30,005 MILES, A time capsule! JUST SOLD.

    31. #29
      Member MadeInJapan's Avatar
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      True....this one is only good for '99-'01 T6 S80's.
      What you need is 1275636 for '99-'00 S70 (non-turbo) or for a turbo- 8670263 which is good for '99-'00 S70's, V70's through '01, C70's through '02, S60 T3's 00-'01, S80 2.9 '99-'01 and S60 '01 non-turbo's.
      All of this information is on eeuroparts.com
      Btw, great savings- plus free shipping on orders of $40 or more.
      '98 S70 T5 Emerald Green IPD and other Upgrades/ '07 S40 T5 M-66 MT Mystic Silver Metallic, Heico Sports Suspension & Cone Air Filter, OZ 18" Wheels, Elevate Dual Exhaust Intake Manifold BOV & Stage 1 Tune, 27mm Racing Beat Rear Sway, Proforged Rear End Links, Ultra Racing Strut Tower brace & E-Focus Mount/ '04 V70 2.5T Ruby Red - IPD Upgrades (wife's car)/ '07 S60 2.5T Barrent Blue (son's car) All: Mobil-1 synthetic @ 5K miles.

    32. #30
      You seem very knowledgeabe on the subject of etm. I live in NY and the Volvo in question is being used by my two daughters in West Hollywood, CA. They had some sort of engine warning light come on and a friend knew how to get the error message and it said throttle boddy. I checked and the car had the free etm software upgrade done already. I called Volvo and they said if the etm has to be replaced it will be replaced free only till the 25th of this month. Would a defective etm produce a "throttle boddy" error message? They have no money and don't know what to do. Do they get a free AAA tow to a nearby Volvo dealer and pay for a $140 diagnostic test (which they won't have to pay for if the etm has to be replaced for free).
      My daughters want to go to an ex-Volvo service manager who's been servicing the car. He claims the problem 99% of the time is not a failed sensor. He wants to replace the throttle boddy for $900.
      I'm advising my daughters to first let Volvo hook up the car to their computer and find out what the problem is in the first place. Then see if it's a free repair or if not what the repair will cost and then go from there.
      What are your thoughts? Thanks very much-
      An anxious father
      Walter Rubin

    33. #31
      Member BEJinFbk's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by WRubin View Post
      You seem very knowledgeabe on the subject of etm. I live in NY and the Volvo in question is being used by my two daughters in West Hollywood, CA. They had some sort of engine warning light come on and a friend knew how to get the error message and it said throttle boddy. I checked and the car had the free etm software upgrade done already. I called Volvo and they said if the etm has to be replaced it will be replaced free only till the 25th of this month. Would a defective etm produce a "throttle boddy" error message? They have no money and don't know what to do. Do they get a free AAA tow to a nearby Volvo dealer and pay for a $140 diagnostic test (which they won't have to pay for if the etm has to be replaced for free).
      My daughters want to go to an ex-Volvo service manager who's been servicing the car. He claims the problem 99% of the time is not a failed sensor. He wants to replace the throttle boddy for $900.
      I'm advising my daughters to first let Volvo hook up the car to their computer and find out what the problem is in the first place. Then see if it's a free repair or if not what the repair will cost and then go from there.
      What are your thoughts? Thanks very much-
      An anxious father
      Walter Rubin
      You may not have noticed, but this is a really old thread...
      Things have improved significantly for ETM repairs.

      Step 1 - Have a good read here:
      http://www.matthewsvolvosite.com/for...forum.php?f=12

      Step 2 - Get out your credit card for these guys:
      http://www.xemodex.com/

      Step 3 - Never worry about the ETM light coming on again!
      '98 V70 R - Is the AWD worth it? You Betcha!

    34. #32
      Former Advertiser TEPPERS AUTO SALES's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by WRubin View Post
      I checked and the car had the free etm software upgrade done already. I called Volvo and they said if the etm has to be replaced it will be replaced free only till the 25th of this month.


      GO TO VOLVO ASAP


      Would a defective etm produce a "throttle boddy" error message?


      YES


      They have no money and don't know what to do. Do they get a free AAA tow to a nearby Volvo dealer.


      NO, (NOT SURE)


      and pay for a $140 diagnostic test

      SHOULDN'T HAVE TO

      My daughters want to go to an ex-Volvo service manager

      NO, NOT NOW

      who's been servicing the car. He claims the problem 99% of the time is not a failed sensor. He wants to replace the throttle boddy for $900.

      FREE FREE FREE

      I'm advising my daughters to first let Volvo hook up the car to their computer and find out what the problem is in the first place. Then see if it's a free repair or if not what the repair will cost and then go from there.
      If she has a ETM light on the dash and it's still under the 10 yr 200K warranty get it to Volvo ASAP
      they have to fix it and a light is almost a 100% go ahead to do so by Volvo's own parameters.

      What year is this Volvo?
      ALL cars in this category are out of warranty on time.
      If it's an 01, you're in the wrong forum (but all said here still applies)
      Last edited by TEPPERS AUTO SALES; 07-03-2011 at 02:40 PM.

    35. #33
      Junior Member C70@PDX's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by BEJinFbk View Post
      You may not have noticed, but this is a really old thread...
      Things have improved significantly for ETM repairs.

      Step 1 - Have a good read here:
      http://www.matthewsvolvosite.com/for...forum.php?f=12

      Step 2 - Get out your credit card for these guys:
      http://www.xemodex.com/

      Step 3 - Never worry about the ETM light coming on again!
      This, plagued for 2 years with failing etm and BS Volvo fix.
      Did the xemodex fix myself 2 months (3K miles) ago, no worries since....

    36. #34
      Do you think I still have warranty on my Volvo S60 T5 2003?
      My car is doing lots of jerking. Went to dealer they told me I need a new tranny.

    37. #35
      Hi, I need your help, if you may. I am from Israel and I bought an S70 year 2000 (SE - No Turbo). I have a problem with the MAF sensor. I am hesitating whether I should or shouldn't buy it over the Internet. People over here say that there is always a chance it might not work if the numbers don't match (we are talking about the original part number). The problem is that the guy that sold me the car cheated me. He replaced the good MAF sensor with a broken one the night before I bought the car, and he obviously denies it so I am unable to drive the car. My question is, how can I buy a suitable MAF sensor without taking a risk of it not being suitable to my car? Some also claim that MAF sensors for S70 come either as Bosch or Denso (that there is no other possibility/manufacturer?) the company over here refuses to give me the original part number but I know for sure that it ends with ...636. I still don't know whether it is by Bosch or Denso or ?? Please help me and tell me what, where, and how to make the correct decision. Thank u in advance. Sincerely, Sharbel18

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