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    1. #1
      Member madden's Avatar
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      Ford Focus RS MK2 turbo...

      Has anyone actually put one in a AWD S40/V50 yet, or FWD? I am seriously thinking of being a test car to develop this, with help. I don't think I've ever heard of someone actually doing it yet. My primary concern would be supporting software, bigger injectors are a given, along with other supporting hardware. The problem is not getting the MK2 turbo, or installing it.. I'm not sure I want to be a guinea pig on this, because without the software, a bigger turbo and injectors are not going to bring much to the table, and potential problems are certainly real. I am not a mechanic nor an expert on these cars, I know enough, however, when to ask for help. Cheers.
      Last edited by madden; 06-25-2010 at 01:38 PM.
      1982 Volvo GLT w/ small block V8, T5 manual tranny and a bunch of stuff. to handle and go fast
      Gone and totaled V50 with a few mods, K16, Enem cams 3' DP and cat back, KW V2 coilovers, etc. I miss that one
      Polestar V60 BSM #44/80

    2. #2
      Junior Member Rocky SDS 09's Avatar
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      I know Kova is also looking hard into that... Can you elaborate on what type of obstacles George has run into?

      And I'm all game. I'll ride the wave madden You let me know how that goes!

      I still like the idea of pushing Autotech hard as hell to get that software developed.. and it sounds like Peter is worthy AND willing to custom tune our cars from half way across the world.. Why can't we find such interest locally??

      I second the test car.. I got a new boost gauge
      ROCKY SDS MOD'D '05 S40 T5 AWD M66 WWW.REVVOLUTION.COM

      My Revvolution Profile

    3. #3
      *IF* this is reasonably attainable and safe with stock internals, this may be the best route to go for direct replacement. I wouldn't expect to see RS numbers without some method of strengthening the cylinder walls and cooling the engine compartment (hood vents and oil cooler?), but maybe it's possible with just injectors & software.

    4. #4
      Well once the turbo-fold upgrade is test fitted (would almost guarantee that it would being the same engine) and the appropriate modifications were made to suit it all you need is a universal tuning source like unichips. Then any tuner should be able to handle it. Thats all that Im waiting on right now is a tuning source. I put my mods on hold months ago because without a tune they are just a waste of time.

      Once the unichip is released I will be more than willing to be the mule for turbo installs. Not really into doing a major swap anymore since I have something else for that but would like a nice streetable power. Mid 300's to the wheels on a reworked ST turbo is what Im eye balling. No modifications required to fit, still instant spool, and with upgraded wheels and port work should flow much much more air.
      TheRetrofitSource | 2020 Motorsports | RTernie | H&R Springs | Import Meet | Girodisc

      Current: E46M (daily) | S40 T5 (grocery getter)
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    5. #5
      I'm waiting for someone to get the STS (Squires Turbo Systems) going for the C30/S40/V50.
      2009 V50 T5 AWD GT: Work in progress: (1) (2) (3) (4) (5)
      Previous rides: (1) (2)

    6. #6
      Maybe we can get a group buy going for the pumaspeed ST350 turbo, for 1300 bucks (before shipping) I think its right where a lot of people wanna be and its straight bolt on!

      According to their website the focus RS turbo is bolt on as well to this engine. From the looks of it might be some slight difference but other than that shouldnt be any surprises. Its freakin expensive though.
      TheRetrofitSource | 2020 Motorsports | RTernie | H&R Springs | Import Meet | Girodisc

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    7. #7
      Junior Member jedgar's Avatar
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      I did a google search to find out more about the ST350, and found this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wgxc7xIFDR4 never mind that 70-120 time (impressive) -- WTF is with the audible redline limiter? It's hilarious.
      John Edgar

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    8. #8
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      Here in the UK a new 'RS' turbo costs roughly 2000 from a Ford dealer and there will not be an alternative source chez Volvo Dealers unless Volvo go ahead with production of the C30R.

      The next hurdle put in place by Uncle Henry is the larger Bosch injectors you will need with the 'RS' KKK turbo at 176 each! There is an alternative even larger injector more generally available, but only through Bosch North American outlets (info. courtesy of Kova) part number 0280 158 117, I believe OE in '07/'10 Shelby Cobra and Cherokee SRT8.

      You will also need the turbo oil feed pipes from the RS and a couple of silicone hoses to get a good fit for air in and out of the turbo. Naturally a good aftermarket exhaust such as Ferrita is required and a big intercooler.

      To hopefully get arround the known tendency of these blocks to crack I have had some shorter, stronger Chinese rods made. I am just about to start fitting all this stuff to my own ST and am hoping to have it ready for the man from MTE to do the callibrations when he is here next. MTE have already mapped a couple of STs with similar modifications and having all the files for both Ford and Volvo software plus the correct Bosch tools should provide a perfect solution with none of the botches that come with a piggy back ecu.

      On the subject of a reworked ST/T5 KKK turbo, all, and I repeat all UK suppliers buy their so called modified turbos from one turbo specialist here in the UK, you can only achieve arround 300bhp at the crank with good software, full exhaust and intercooler. This small standard turbo has a very thin shaft which fits into a small casting with no room to machine out for a bigger diameter one which would be needed if you went for bigger wheels. The 'RS' KKK has however a construction suited to 400bhp or more with some modifications.

      You can consider such as a Garrett, Holset or even Mitsubishi TDO5 as an alternative to the costly RS KKK, but once you have added in a separate manifold, special piping, hoses etc., plus appropriate downpipe the RS turbo looks a fairly priced alternative.

      Regards, Don.

      PS. I would appreciate the contact details of a Bosch outlet in the US or Canada from whom I could get a price for the above mentioned big injectors if anyone has a favoured supplier.

    9. #9
      Member EngTech's Avatar
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      Don, How Much is the RS Turbo System Costing You ?
      won't the 550cc Injectors do the Trick from Puma ?
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    10. #10
      Member madden's Avatar
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      You can get Ford Racing fuel injectors pretty reasonably #M-9593-G302 47lb/hr type EV14 11-18 ohms, a pack of 8 for around $250.00, that's only, $31.25 each. Available from R&E Racing. I don't see why these would not work. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.
      1982 Volvo GLT w/ small block V8, T5 manual tranny and a bunch of stuff. to handle and go fast
      Gone and totaled V50 with a few mods, K16, Enem cams 3' DP and cat back, KW V2 coilovers, etc. I miss that one
      Polestar V60 BSM #44/80

    11. #11
      Hello Don,

      May I ask how the shorter rods aim to resolve the liner cracking issue? My understanding is that is down to excessive peak temperature?

      Would you also be adding the R headgasket in place of the ST one? My understanding is that the R gasket is uprated over the ST (T5) one. I'd of course love to learn the details of how the R one differs.

      Would you also be using the R series camshafts ie the ones Ford also adopted for the RS.

      Sounds like you're working with MTE to make an RS of the ST base car

      Interesting developments generally are Volvo's approval of Polestar, Heico and K-Pax maps sold via dealers which effectively gives a safe route to the R type performance.

      The multinamed option of K-Pax, Polestar and Heico means maybe MTE could also get in on that?

      Is the Polestar 400bhp C30 Concept using the RS's KKK unit?

    12. #12
      Polestar concept uses KKK 26 turbo

      http://www.volvocars.com/uk/top/abou...aspx?itemid=41

      Is that the RS one?

    13. #13
      Member madden's Avatar
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      No, the Ford Focus RS turbo is a K16. I have been researching this to death. Since the Ford Focus RS is essentially the same motor as ours with slight changes, coated sleeves, bigger injectors, different cams,nonetheless, the turbo itself should bolt right on, with minor tweaking. Fitment is not the issue here, supporting software is. I'm not looking for 400HP, but I want to take it up one more notch. I have already done all the bolt-ons I can do. Why is it so hard to mod these cars?
      1982 Volvo GLT w/ small block V8, T5 manual tranny and a bunch of stuff. to handle and go fast
      Gone and totaled V50 with a few mods, K16, Enem cams 3' DP and cat back, KW V2 coilovers, etc. I miss that one
      Polestar V60 BSM #44/80

    14. #14
      Quote Originally Posted by madden View Post
      No, the Ford Focus RS turbo is a K16. I have been researching this to death. Since the Ford Focus RS is essentially the same motor as ours with slight changes, coated sleeves, bigger injectors, different cams,nonetheless, the turbo itself should bolt right on, with minor tweaking. Fitment is not the issue here, supporting software is. I'm not looking for 400HP, but I want to take it up one more notch. I have already done all the bolt-ons I can do. Why is it so hard to mod these cars?
      No one wants to pony up the initial R&D costs for a niche market with low potential profits. The Volvo C30 may change this, along with canning that relatively inadequate NA 2.4 engine (meaning all P1s will have the same T5 engine - larger total marketability for the aftermarket).

    15. #15
      Member EngTech's Avatar
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      VolvoGoteborg



      You forgot to Mention One Other , U.K. tuners - Mountune

      http://www.worldcarfans.com/11004092...nounced---ford
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    16. #16
      Member EngTech's Avatar
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      Also I will Add some of the Most Important Info Out There, What's That You say ?
      A New FDM - Fuel Delivery M - Upping the Pressure and Flow Rate - which in Turn Lowers & reduces the Injector Duty-Cycle .


      http://www.mountuneperformance.com/i...39:latest-news
      Last edited by EngTech; 06-26-2010 at 09:27 AM.
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    17. #17
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      Quote Originally Posted by don.norchi View Post
      PS. I would appreciate the contact details of a Bosch outlet in the US or Canada from whom I could get a price for the above mentioned big injectors if anyone has a favoured supplier.
      I bought the injectors from these guys:

      http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/BOSCH...Q5fCarQ5fParts
      Last edited by kova; 06-26-2010 at 01:59 PM.

    18. #18
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      Peter (Autotech) already fitted RS turbo in a test C70 T5 car in Sweden and made initial version of the tune for it. Everything seems to be working fine, he will have the car back for some fine tuning in a few weeks so I guess we can expect him to finish the tune by the end of the August.
      Last edited by kova; 06-26-2010 at 02:01 PM.

    19. #19
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      Quote Originally Posted by VolvoGoteborg View Post

      May I ask how the shorter rods aim to resolve the liner cracking issue? My understanding is that is down to excessive peak temperature?
      Liner cracking is due to the excessive temperature. What would help (beside the very precise tune, keeping the boost low and achieving power in higher revs) is high flow cat. My target is keeping max torque bellow 440Nm.

    20. #20
      Member EngTech's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by kova View Post
      Liner cracking is due to the excessive temperature. What would help (beside the very precise tune, keeping the boost low and achieving power in higher revs) is high flow cat. My target is keeping max torque bellow 440Nm.
      Kova : The Excessive Temperature Guards that Ford put in place on the RS , was to assure No Issues during Tracking of the RS .

      If You only used the New Power - for a Sprint or Two - seems the T5 should hold up well , but I'd still be interested in the RS Oil Cooler for more consistent Temps.
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    21. #21
      Member SiCkEsTC30's Avatar
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      installing a methanol injection should keep the cylinder temps down some

    22. #22
      Member EngTech's Avatar
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      Talking Yeah, Good Show Cat's Out of the Bag Now .

      Quote Originally Posted by SiCkEsTC30 View Post
      installing a methanol injection should keep the cylinder temps down some

      Yes, and so would a IC - CO2 Spray Ring , and a Fuel Cooling - extra 10 ft. on fuel line wound inside a Custom A/C Condenser .

      Very Large Bag of Dry-Ice on the Manifold , and only driving the Cranked Up Motor in Spring & Fall .
      ** V50 AWD - Handling & Performance Tweaks = New Stance / VW CC - Handling Tweaks - Testing & Porting - Intake Mods
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    23. #23
      Member SiCkEsTC30's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by EngTech View Post
      Yes, and so would a IC - CO2 Spray Ring , and a Fuel Cooling - extra 10 ft. on fuel line wound inside a Custom A/C Condenser .

      Very Large Bag of Dry-Ice on the Manifold , and only driving the Cranked Up Motor in Spring & Fall .
      but methanol is the easiest one to do

    24. #24
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      POP !

      Quote Originally Posted by SiCkEsTC30 View Post
      but methanol is the easiest one to do
      Yes, and It would help.
      I'm starting to think I should just drive My Volvo and Enjoy It .
      The Tighter & Tighter You Squeeze these thing , pretty soon Poop comes Out .

      I don't want - Poop coming out of My Motor .
      ** V50 AWD - Handling & Performance Tweaks = New Stance / VW CC - Handling Tweaks - Testing & Porting - Intake Mods
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    25. #25
      Hello

      Yes Mountune developed (for, with and approved by Ford) the RS500 tune which is also available as an aftermarket kit from Mountune.

      NS the RS engine has S60/V70R internals which the T5 does not.

      What is odd though is Ford was willing to spend this R&D on a short lived project (18 months of production so far, 2 years planned). Would be nice if Volvo had cash like that to launch the C30R.

      Of course the RS wouldnt exist without the Volvo engine, Volvo gearbox.....

    26. #26
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      HELLO

      Quote Originally Posted by VolvoGoteborg View Post
      Hello

      Yes Mountune developed (for, with and approved by Ford) the RS500 tune which is also available as an aftermarket kit from Mountune.

      NS the RS engine has S60/V70R internals which the T5 does not.

      What is odd though is Ford was willing to spend this R&D on a short lived project (18 months of production so far, 2 years planned). Would be nice if Volvo had cash like that to launch the C30R.

      Of course the RS wouldnt exist without the Volvo engine, Volvo gearbox.....
      RS Internal's are way Better then what's in a R -

      Where does It State that about the B5254T3 - T7
      ** V50 AWD - Handling & Performance Tweaks = New Stance / VW CC - Handling Tweaks - Testing & Porting - Intake Mods
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    27. #27
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      Exclamation Rs cooler - ?

      Quote Originally Posted by kova View Post
      I bought the injectors from these guys:

      http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/BOSCH...Q5fCarQ5fParts
      Those Injectors You bought - did You Install them Yet ,and Do those have the 6 Holes ?


      When I ran My - Reader on the ECU and had a Tune at the Time in Early Winter for those Test, the Water Temp would jump Up Quick - everytime You step on It . That's why I got the IC as it would take 3-4 miles to bring Water down & 8 miles to bring Intake Temps . read
      ( It was 38 Degrees out side ) so when Tracking a Really Cranked Up Turbo T5 , I feel Your going to need a Much Better - Radiator also . I was Hoping the
      RS Oil Cooler was going to be of Help . Let Us Know how many Fins are on that RS Cooler .

      OK got You Message 14 Plates - Good to Know I have a RS Oil Cooler !
      Last edited by EngTech; 08-26-2010 at 05:56 PM.
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    28. #28
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      Quote Originally Posted by EngTech View Post
      Those Injectors You bought - did You Install them Yet ,and Do those have the 6 Holes ?


      When I ran My - Reader on the ECU and had a Tune at the Time in Early Winter for those Test, the Water Temp would jump Up Quick - everytime You step on It . That's why I got the IC as it would take 3-4 miles to bring Water down & 8 miles to bring Intake Temps . read
      ( It was 38 Degrees out side ) so when Tracking a Really Cranked Up Turbo T5 , I feel Your going to need a Much Better - Radiator also . I was Hoping the
      RS Oil Cooler was going to be of Help . Let Us Know how many Fins are on that RS Cooler .

      OK got You Message 14 Plates - Good to Know I have a RS Oil Cooler !
      No, I didn't - you have to adjust the software when changing injectors, so I'll install them together with the RS turbo. Same goes for colder sparkplugs.

      Yes, they have 6 holes. Spray pattern looks like on this picture:

      Last edited by kova; 08-27-2010 at 01:51 AM.

    29. #29
      Re Eng Tech

      "RS Internal's are way Better then what's in a R"

      This has been discussed earlier and the RS uses the S60R internals

      The RS either uses the stock RNC T5 parts (unlikely) or the S60R internals.

      Pulling an RS engine would confirm this for sure as Ford won't admit it!

    30. #30
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      Quote Originally Posted by VolvoGoteborg View Post
      Re Eng Tech

      "RS Internal's are way Better then what's in a R"

      This has been discussed earlier and the RS uses the S60R internals

      The RS either uses the stock RNC T5 parts (unlikely) or the S60R internals.

      Pulling an RS engine would confirm this for sure as Ford won't admit it!
      Judging by the compression ratio RS most probably uses S60R internals. RS and S60R have 8,5:1 static compression ratio, while our T5 has 9,0:1 (typical for low pressure turbo engines).
      This means that extra care should be taken when tuning our engines..

    31. #31
      Hello Kova!

      I ws just going to reference our chat with Johann here

      http://forums.swedespeed.com/showthr...15#post1557515

      Johann also comments the RS may use the larger pin pistons

      Fords press release states

      "The objective was increasing power and torque without affecting durability. To meet that, multiple detail changes were made to the powertrain including a revised cylinder head gasket, ultra-durable metal sprayed cylinder bores, revised pistons and a bespoke camshaft profile and connecting rods, allowing bigger small end bearings.

      However, the most obvious changes are the new intake system, exhaust manifold and turbocharger. The larger Borg Warner K16 turbo fitted to Focus RS offers a maximum steady state boost pressure of 1.4 bar double that of Focus STs 0.7 bar to generate the cars 35 per cent power increase. "

      from http://www.autotrader.co.uk/EDITORIA..._focus_rs.html

      which suggests Johann's suspicion is right ie the RS uses the larger pin pistons which added to what I've learnt to date and what you know, means the RS uses R internals. I'm trying to find out for sure for sure but this looks 99% to me.

      Indeed, pushing a 2.5T RNC needs some caution give the rods and pistons. One could build your own RS engine from Volvo parts but it seems you do need the Ford uprated headgasket for the RS RNC unit. Upgraded over the standard 2.5T headgasket used in all P1 cars and the Y20 S80 and V70.
      Volvo's RN R series engine (S60R/V70R) used a gasket uprated over the standard one anyway.

    32. #32
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      Quote Originally Posted by VolvoGoteborg View Post
      Hello Kova!

      I ws just going to reference our chat with Johann here

      http://forums.swedespeed.com/showthr...15#post1557515

      Johann also comments the RS may use the larger pin pistons

      Fords press release states

      "The objective was increasing power and torque without affecting durability. To meet that, multiple detail changes were made to the powertrain including a revised cylinder head gasket, ultra-durable metal sprayed cylinder bores, revised pistons and a bespoke camshaft profile and connecting rods, allowing bigger small end bearings.

      However, the most obvious changes are the new intake system, exhaust manifold and turbocharger. The larger Borg Warner K16 turbo fitted to Focus RS offers a maximum steady state boost pressure of 1.4 bar double that of Focus STs 0.7 bar to generate the cars 35 per cent power increase. "

      from http://www.autotrader.co.uk/EDITORIA..._focus_rs.html

      which suggests Johann's suspicion is right ie the RS uses the larger pin pistons which added to what I've learnt to date and what you know, means the RS uses R internals. I'm trying to find out for sure for sure but this looks 99% to me.

      Indeed, pushing a 2.5T RNC needs some caution give the rods and pistons. One could build your own RS engine from Volvo parts but it seems you do need the Ford uprated headgasket for the RS RNC unit. Upgraded over the standard 2.5T headgasket used in all P1 cars and the Y20 S80 and V70.
      Volvo's RN R series engine (S60R/V70R) used a gasket uprated over the standard one anyway.
      Hi!

      R engine was designed with the same nominal power in mind (300HP) and very similar turbo. My guess is that they probably modified intake, Ford added this metal-spraying, and some other minor changes. In short, they started from R engine and modified it to build RS.

      As far as I know, thin cylinder walls are the major reason for P1 engine breaks in UK - you can almost count on your fingers Focus ST engines that survived powers over 300HP in UK. My plan is to keep the mixture relatively rich and avoid too much midrange torque but to build power with high RPM's. High flow DP with 100CPI cat and 3" catback are also essential to keep the EGT as low as possible. In that case you can hope to reach even 400HP (theoretically) and the internals (rods, pistons, even clutch ..) will survive.

    33. #33
      Hi, yeah that's the last piece of the puzzle which is to find out more about the metal spraying of sorts.

    34. #34
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      The 'metal spraying' is solely a plasma sprayed aluminium coating of the outside of the liners. When the molten metal is poured to form the block this coating fuses with it to form a much stronger bore wall.

      Don.

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      Quote Originally Posted by don.norchi View Post
      The 'metal spraying' is solely a plasma sprayed aluminium coating of the outside of the liners. When the molten metal is poured to form the block this coating fuses with it to form a much stronger bore wall.

      Don.
      Precisely. As far as I know this is Ford technology. Ford also contributed Revonuckle technology, but that is also a sort of compromise because it is nothing more then cheaper version of double wishbone.

      Great shame that Volvo doesn't have it on FWD models, even Alfa has it these days..

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