V60 Coming Stateside as Diesel-Electric Hybrid?

[stu@swedespeed]

Yes, while Volvo’s current range of wagons continues its exodus from the North American market, recent conversations suggest there may still be an outside chance for the company’s newest and most striking estate, the V60. But as with most great news, there is a catch.

FULL STORY

[exizldelfuego]

If a plug-in hybrid Volvo makes it stateside, I’ll buy it; especially if it’s a V60. I’ve a brother who’d probably follow suit.

[02s60t5]

Volvo really should bring the V60 stateside, since there is virtually no competition in the segment. Forget about the expensive, not-yet-developed, diesel hybrid technology for the time being and just bring it over in traditional T5 FWD and T6 AWD guise. Though there aren't currently many wagon buyers, Volvo would attract a good chunk of the ones who do exist, and they will be way ahead of the competition when fuel prices once again chase people out of their SUVs.

[almostarctic]

I'd buy a V70 T5 FWD. But in the mean time, my 99 v70xc still churns. I looked at the wagons out there, The bmw is too pricey, the audi and venza too fugly. The only intriguing one which could kill Volvo is the acura tsx wagon. It looks nice on spec but might be small.

We'll see.

[SkyKiD]

DRIVe and T5 would be the most logical ones to bring in larger numbers than the T6 but they should also keep the total numbers low in that way cars dont just sit in dealer lots. V60 R-design would be nice as well, those suspension tweaks could possibly be well worth it especially on the lighter T5.

[pattyweb]

I'd buy a V70 T5 FWD. But in the mean time, my 99 v70xc still churns. I looked at the wagons out there, The bmw is too pricey, the audi and venza too fugly. The only intriguing one which could kill Volvo is the acura tsx wagon. It looks nice on spec but might be small.

We'll see.

Actually, I think it's the other way around. The V60 looks to be the smallest wagon in it's class. From best (V70) to worst (V60) in class space wise? The TSX is actually quite a bit bigger than a V60. Almost half a foot longer with more rear leg room and more cargo space.

[Blu Angel]

I would buy the V60 diesel in a heartbeat!
Would Volvo Canada take my Cadillac CTS AWD as a trade-in?

[swimmer240]

The thing that worries me about this move is Volvo abandoned the wagon here, and its answer is a Diesel Hybrid. As the article states, a Diesel engine AND hybrid powertrain will make this one expensive automobile, and while there are those out there willing to shell money out to appear more green or because they are green, I would imagine the sales of that particular breed of V60 would not have very high sales numbers (MHO). Would I love to own such a car? Hell yes. Will I be able to afford it? Not even in my dreams unless they offer some amazing incentives.

Why does Volvo not start with just bringing the V60 over here and see what people think of the design? Why doesn't Volvo bring the OPTION of a manual transmission back and bring the V60 stateside. I was reading Car and Driver or one of those magazines Car Buyers guide, and on both the S50/V50 review and the new S60 review, in the con section was listed and I quote "no manual transmission." Obviously many of us here on SS have voiced our opinion on it, but the car magazine, which is not so partial to the bricks, also is commenting on the fact manual is not even an option.

I would think Volvo would want to try bringing a diesel engine here first and seeing if people will pay the added price for that before they bring over a fully loaded and what I would estimate to be a very pricey wagon. But again, I would love to just see this wagon on the US shores regardless.

[VolvoGoteborg]

Hi

To date the official info from Volvo is a plug in hybrid diesel in 2012 - now confirmed to be the V60. See the article published with Volvo about the V60 diesel hybrid in Teknikens Varld

http://forums.swedespeed.com/showthr...ghlight=v60+H6

Volvo officially says the C30 Electric and a plug in hybrid with a gasoline engine will come stateside.

Your suggestion that Volvo does something unique akin to the unique bodystyle of the Pruis etc by offering the sports-coupe-estate V60 as a diesel hybrid is interesting. A unique car plus a unique drivetrain is interesting.

[ss60]

If I understand it corectly the electric drive is to the rear wheels. Finally a RWD Volvo; at least untill the battery runs down.

[VolvoGoteborg]

Quote "If I understand it corectly the electric drive is to the rear wheels. Finally a RWD Volvo; at least untill the battery runs down. "

True - RWD is back - at least for short trips

[DCPattie]

Diesel-Electric Hybrid - across the entire Volvo range. Now that would put Volvo on the map! I'd like to see Diesel-Electric Hybrid on the next gen XC90!

[Kighter]

The TSX is not only a 4, but a 5-speed slushbox.

I have the original TSX - 4 but with a 6MT, and far less fat. This Sport Wagon is not that.

[V50T5OSD]

Auto mobile a German car show tested the V60 in the 200hp version, liked the car but!, the tester stated the Audi (A4) was roomier, the BMW (3) was sportier, and the MB(C) was more expensive. the V60 fits somewhere in the middle, the car tested cost over 50K euros, had all the new tech goodies, yet still not a loaded car.

[EngTech]

OK Here's the - Deal - all these Hybrids being built this way , which is Off an already Designed AWD Platform - Simply are - Cheater to Build !

1. Removal of the Drive shaft , and all corresponding Components = ( Money & Labor & Warranties ) : It is essentially a FWD with Electric Back Motors 2 driving those Wheels .
This is being Supported with Government Grants .

2. Usually a Smaller Motor is Employed in the Front - T5 vs T6

3. This Government Backing is Not Trickling down to the Consumer !
4. We should be Getting Huge rewards for Investing in such ( New Tech ) -- Tax Breaks - seem to only be Big on the Toyota Pirus , and those seem to have Dried Up !

5. Is this New type of AWD a Welcome Addition ? Only If they make it is Cost Effective to the Buyer , not like some others Auto makers that have these type of Units , but are
Gouging the Public !

6. That Means Up Front Cost , Tax Breaks , and Long Term Cost Saving , like Free Battery Replacement @ 150,000 miles , Not Forced into Investing Another $35,000 -
due to Pre-Engineered - Failure !

If You really Look Under the Sheets ( See Whom is being Screwed ) most of these Battery / Fuel Hybrids the Battery - pack last 8 yrs. ( Here's the Catch ) OR 100,000 Miles !

HELLO Most of Us Americans put 100,000 miles in 3-4 yrs. / So We throw It Out in 4 yrs. , Buy a $8000.00 Battery Pack , or Trade - Either Way - We the Consumer are Taking
a Huge Financial Beat Down .
The Trade will worthless , as No one will want the Old Battery's , There will be a Recycling Cost , and in the Mean While --- NO ONE is saying what has Happened to
Your Home Electric Bill !

[Almuliman]

If You really Look Under the Sheets ( See Whom is being Screwed ) most of these Battery / Fuel Hybrids the Battery - pack last 8 yrs. ( Here's the Catch ) OR 100,000 Miles !

HELLO Most of Us Americans put 100,000 miles in 3-4 yrs. / So We throw It Out in 4 yrs. , Buy a $8000.00 Battery Pack , or Trade - Either Way - We the Consumer are Taking
a Huge Financial Beat Down .
The Trade will worthless , as No one will want the Old Battery's , There will be a Recycling Cost , and in the Mean While --- NO ONE is saying what has Happened to
Your Home Electric Bill !

Your electric bill will likely be a lot lower than your equivalent fuel (gas or diesel) bill, depending on how you get your electricity. I looked around a bit and found that the fuel for an electric vehicle with an energy efficiency of 3 miles per kWh (apparently about average today) costs about 3.0 cents per mile when electricity costs 9 cents per kWh (current avg. per private household). With gas @ $3.20/gallon, for a vehicle getting 22 mpg fuel cost is around 14 cents per mile (http://avt.inel.gov/pdf/fsev/costs.pdf; Idaho National Labs, Advanced Vehicle Testing Activity, a US DOE operation). I know what I'd choose based on $/mile. YMMV depending on, well, everything in those equations along with how much you paid for the vehicle in the first place.

Latest numbers I can find for sure say that the average American drove 13,476 miles/year in 2003 (Federal Highway Administration; http://www.fhwa.dot.gov/ohim/onh00/bar8.htm), so that's around 7.4 years of battery life, not 3-4. NADA and KBB uses 15k/yr and even that is 6.7 years of battery life.

Will there be a battery replacement program? A subsidy (from the manufacturer or state/federal government)? Can the battery be reconstituted (no idea if that's even feasible)?

There are just too many unknowns at this time.

Having said that, I don't like EVs, hybrids or not. There's just too much extra weight to drag around for the power it supplies to make it a likable engineering solution. Not to say it's not a politically or financially viable solution for somebody - be it the manufacturer or owner of the car or somebody in the supply chain or the state/federal government - but at this time it's just not for me.

[EngTech]

At 16 cent a Kilo-Watt - has anyone heard what one of these Babies , adds to You Bill ?

Say a Charge every 2 days with an average of 120 Charges per Yr.

Do any of these come with a Wind Powered - Charging System for the Home ?

Sun-Powered Charging system for the Home ?

[Almuliman]

At 16 cent a Kilo-Watt - has anyone heard what one of these Babies , adds to You Bill ?

Say a Charge every 2 days with an average of 120 Charges per Yr.

Do any of these come with a Wind Powered - Charging System for the Home ?

Sun-Powered Charging system for the Home ?

Oh, if only our dimwitted Owners' Association covenants would allow solar arrays (they probably do allow the roofing tile replacement ones) or "personal" wind mills. I like the idea of being able to selectively disable the battery and/or have it drive the secondary set of wheels for AWD.

[BendBlueS80]

Dear Volvo:

What are you waiting for?!

Why is GM getting all the media buzz over a product they can't even GET to the market when Volvo is sitting on the one plug-in hybrid that may very well be the best option yet? Can we at least have a waiting list?

[JBLasVegas]

Instead, he cryptically noted that a wagon like the V60 was an “enthusiast’s vehicle” and could be made to come here, but it would have to offer something unique like maybe a hybrid badge.

^^^
What a load!!!
Typical European Socialist stodgy Volvo thinking. LOL!!!
I wonder what the badge would be... maybe a little lightning bolt?
I just looked at an Acura V6 that would probably blow the doors off of a Volvo for probably $5K less. (Not a wagon though)

[jlj3394]

OK Here's the - Deal - all these Hybrids being built this way , which is Off an already Designed AWD Platform - Simply are - Cheater to Build !

1. Removal of the Drive shaft , and all corresponding Components = ( Money & Labor & Warranties ) : It is essentially a FWD with Electric Back Motors 2 driving those Wheels .
This is being Supported with Government Grants .

2. Usually a Smaller Motor is Employed in the Front - T5 vs T6

3. This Government Backing is Not Trickling down to the Consumer !
4. We should be Getting Huge rewards for Investing in such ( New Tech ) -- Tax Breaks - seem to only be Big on the Toyota Pirus , and those seem to have Dried Up !

5. Is this New type of AWD a Welcome Addition ? Only If they make it is Cost Effective to the Buyer , not like some others Auto makers that have these type of Units , but are
Gouging the Public !

6. That Means Up Front Cost , Tax Breaks , and Long Term Cost Saving , like Free Battery Replacement @ 150,000 miles , Not Forced into Investing Another $35,000 -
due to Pre-Engineered - Failure !

If You really Look Under the Sheets ( See Whom is being Screwed ) most of these Battery / Fuel Hybrids the Battery - pack last 8 yrs. ( Here's the Catch ) OR 100,000 Miles !

HELLO Most of Us Americans put 100,000 miles in 3-4 yrs. / So We throw It Out in 4 yrs. , Buy a $8000.00 Battery Pack , or Trade - Either Way - We the Consumer are Taking
a Huge Financial Beat Down .
The Trade will worthless , as No one will want the Old Battery's , There will be a Recycling Cost , and in the Mean While --- NO ONE is saying what has Happened to
Your Home Electric Bill !

I've got a buddy with a 140,000 mile Prius and the original battery pack. Still holds 92% of original capacity.

Where are you getting your 100,000 numbers?

[pattyweb]

I've got a buddy with a 140,000 mile Prius and the original battery pack. Still holds 92% of original capacity.

Here's another interesting article about a 206K mile prius that's still basically getting the same mileage after 10years.

206K-mile Toyota Prius MPG Nearly Matches "New Figures

[EngTech]

City Dweller's will see these Vech. as Good , as they may only put 7,000 - 9,000 on a Yr.
Take a 1200 miles trip in one - Hmm ? Don't see the MPG -Rating very High for that .
Free Plug-Ins at the Hotel / Motel - ( Maybe ) , but doubt It !

The Added 8-9 hrs. to Charge - OK for Old Folks - that have all the time in the World , just add an Extra Hotel stay .

The Government Should be getting Behind , these a lot more , and First set of Batteries - should be Free . ( Tell them to put their money where their Mouth is ) OUR MONEY !

A Diesel would at least be able to get folks to places at a good clip & return Decent - MPG
The Electric Part is a Bonus for AWD - it should be able to be -( Manually be Shut Off )- Extending the Life of the Batteries , so to Encourage Buyer's - that drive 16,000 miles a yr. to Own One .
Average Compute in US is 40 Plus Miles 1 way .

[EngTech]

10-4 Peter on the Selective - AWD only when Necessary !


Volvo would really Win a Bunch of Costumers - on that One Idea !


Just Imagine , instead of being forced to trade the Car at 4-5 yrs. You now could Go 8-10 Yrs.

The Difference between charging every 2 days vs ever 4 days or an average of 60 times a yr. vs 120 Plus times a yr.
Now You have an Investment that Last min. 8 yrs. .. . . . . . . . . . .

That is H-U-G-E !


HOA - will come on Line - Fast with Home Charging systems .

[EngTech]

* Lets Add to that * My Computer User interface : Where I Dial Up or Down the AWD system , and It ( The Monitor ) Informs me the Average Time Line or Miles before a Charge would be Necessary .

OK , this will shoot a huge Whole in the Volt , etc. - Now I looking at Spending $35,000 !

In Good weather 40 plus degrees , system Offers to be Disengaged ( DIS ) or ( DF Only ) - once De-selected - It recalculates Battery's Life Span vs Fuel Cost .

[EngTech]

Anyone Know how Large of a Fuel Tank for the Diesel / Hybrid - still Interested in Buying One . Especially at 745 Mile Range , Thanks
Dan

[EngTech]

Just looking at Average driver puts on ( Miles ) which , I read somewhere they use a Number , and the Real Number is What ? ( Not Miles , but Years )
Life Span of the battery Pack - I'd say is more Important - It also comes down to How many times the Battery Pack - can be Charged !

I'd like to see what is electric Bill was Before Owner ship , and Now ?


Is HIs Battery Pack 8 yrs . Old ?

[slrising]

Home electirc bills won't change significantly as the average cost of ELEC in the us per KW/h is under .20 cents at the highest regions outside CONUS (48 states) US average is somewhere closer t0 6-7 cents KW/h and currently plug-in Hybrids charging for over 13 hours draw less than 2 KW/H to recharge the battery.

Figure 2 cars average per family @ .10 cents per KW/H @ 2 KW/H 2(.10*2)= .40 cents per day to recharge both vehicles or if recharging everyday a grand total of less than $150.00 annually not which most two car familys couldn't get by on for one month in fuel costs unless each care is limited to less than .8 miles per day with current gas prices. Even if one doesn't car about the environment, the money saving benifit alone is crazy.

Figure this average annual mileage in the US per car is ~12,500 so 2 car family: 25k per year at $3 per gallon average fuel econ of around 25mpg so (25k/25)*3 or $3000 per year on fuel on average, average ownership @ 5 years or total saved by having a plug-in hybrid $15k about half the current price of one plus government incentives and whatnot, the only thing left ot consider is are the batteries that need recycled or disposed of and the CO2 expended by the electric plant in making the electricity your now using are worse for the enviornment than all the CO2 expended from the conventional vehicle....we know the answer to that so it really doesn't make sense not to buy a vehicle like this unless its purly a plug-in hybrid and the range won't carry you on your daily commute (which may be the case for many) or a nessecity to have a vehicle (work truck, 4 wheel drive...farmers and outdoor workers who frequent off road areas for work).

I much as I Love gasoline powered cars, my next car will most likely be something like this. But Hybrids and electric vehicles don't have to be boring and under powered, we seen a few examples of the high performance ones (gotta raise the public awarenss on the torque procuded by and electric motor) and while we are on this road to electric powered vehicles we need to be converting the power plants over to (Water, Wind, Solar and Geothermal power sources and maybe bridge the gap with Nuclear power in the meantime (another public awareness battle with Nuclear though).

How long until they start raising the electicity rates???

[EngTech]

OK, just checking the Math , If a 16 or 18 K/Watt Battery Pack has to be Charged - It seems it would have to take 16 K/watts , so using Your 2 KW / H & a 13 Hour Draw - wouldn't that = 26 KW ?

Our Rates have been going up every 3 yrs.

Anyhow lets say the Battery Pack - packs - back in 16 K/Watts for 8 - 12 hours charge time for a 18 KW Battery Pack - as it's going to be ramping up or down for Battery Life .

The average Commuter in states goes 30-40 miles 1 way , 60-80 miles round trip . It's going to need a charge every night - Local rate here is 16 cent a Kilo-Watt :
16 cents X 16 KW X 5 Days X 52 Weeks = $655.60 for 1 car . So this might show Average to Worst Case Scenario .

The Eff% of the recharge system might be 88% also , If Your running a 220 and the Wire run is only 15 ft .
Seems My latest computers Power system is 95% which is a huge leap up from mosts computer power supplies are 80%
My Old Computer with a Raid Card & Dual Drives was really burning juice - ( Gone ) . I have Installed 38 Energy Saving Bulbs also .

I like the Idea of the V60 - If it can be switch Off , so Your just on FWD vs AWD for bad weather .
I believe If one was to Charge a Toyota Pirius every day it's batteries would be Dead in 6 yrs. and @ yr 5 - only holding 88% total .

Geo-Thermal is a Great and Up coming energy source , and so is Tide Action , the personal House hold Wind Mill is starting to come down in price .
There has been some nice advances in Batteries , but it's going to take a very good Regenerative Brake system & Possibly a Solar roof Roof Panel - to keep cost in Owner Ship at Very Good value - reducing Charging Cost .
The other Major Item is Battery Life - this really needs to be 8 + yrs. , so Consumer aren't getting Hammered , as Replacement Battery Packs are like $8000.00 & Up .
$8000.00 & Up that's Crazy Money - that works out to be 80 - 18K Work Drills & most of those come with 2 Batteries = 160 - 18k Batteries with 2.8 - 3.0 Hr. work load.
If You take the Drill out of the Equation - then You have 320 Batteries Plus .
There's No reason these Battery Pack Hybrids should be costing this much , most governments are Subsidizing - Battery Research & Hybrid Development .

Where's My Trickle Down ?

[EngTech]

Here's a Pretty good Hybrid - http://www.zercustoms.com/news/Volvo-ReCharge.html

[EngTech]

That was a Hand Selected Vehicle to Compare - the Real Question is How Many Failed @ 6-7 yrs. so that the Valve of Vehicle was ( Worthless ) ?

They need to prove The Batteries - will last 8-10 yrs. or Free Replacement once Batteries fall below 90% capacity , that would be My Trickle Down !

[EngTech]

It's ----- 2012 , and You can get in Line Now !

[rsxer63]

I heard the Volvo Hybrid will be over $70k! Is that true?

[GrecianVolvo]

I heard the Volvo Hybrid will be over $70k! Is that true?

No. You have probably seen stories regarding a potential cost of a C30 Electric (lease payments added plus cost of purchase after lease -- all speculation at this point).

[twbannon]

Been following the forums from time to time regading when or if the V60 will ever come to the US market. Been a long time Volvo buyer. I really don't care if the Us. V60 was a hybrid or diesel - regular gas is fine. So any idea when we might know one way or another? I have a XC60 and love it, but having the SUV already, I need the next car for my wife. Want smaller than the XC60, want better gas mileage, and want a little more utility than the average small sedan. So it sounds like the V60 would be great. Seem like the acura tsx wagon is about the only mid sized cool looking wagon other than V60. Thanks for any insight.