XC90 vs VW Atlas
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    1. #1
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      XC90 vs VW Atlas

      I saw a pop-up add for a new vehicle, the VW Atlas. It certainly looks impressive and has a compelling price tag (a poor man's Q7?)

      I tried to go through the build tool but my web browser kept choking at the color selection stage. (perhaps they are inundated with curious shoppers?)

      Anyone else been able to look at the Atlas? How does it stack up to the XC90?

      Here:
      http://www.vw.com/models/atlas/

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    3. #2
      Global Moderator Paradox's Avatar
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      Yep, it's a VW Q7. I still prefer my XC90 to my Q7 so I don't think I'd go for this either. Even being cheaper than a Q7, I just can't 'get' with mine and await trading it in about 2-3 more years...
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    4. #3
      I think the Atlas has a great value proposition. But it's not an XC90 competitor. More a threat to Ford Explorers and Jeep Cherokees, in that segment.

      But you get a lot for 35k, or even less. And, frankly, it looks way better than the Q7. For as much as I like the Q7 as a car, the exterior look is of a station wagon. The Atlas, at least, looks like an SUV.
      Last edited by VxF; 06-17-2017 at 08:13 AM.

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    6. #4
      Saw it at the car show. Wasn't impressed. A TON of plastic materials. Very plain and definitely not a competitor to the XC90.

    7. #5
      Quote Originally Posted by VxF View Post
      I think the Atlas has a great value proposition. But it's not an XC90 competitor. More a threat to Ford Explorers and Jeep Cherokees, in that segment.

      But you get a lot for 35k, or even less. And, frankly, it looks way better than the Q7. For as much as I like the Q7 as a car, the exterior look is of a station wagon. The Atlas, at least, looks like an SUV.
      I don't understand that comparison of the Q7. Most big SUVs look like "station wagons." I don't see how the xc90 looks less like an overgrown wagon than a Q7 does.

    8. #6
      Junior Member Ivos's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Paradox View Post
      I still prefer my XC90 to my Q7 .
      Interesting. And what do you like less on Q7 ?
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    9. #7
      Quote Originally Posted by 02s80 View Post
      I don't understand that comparison of the Q7. Most big SUVs look like "station wagons." I don't see how the xc90 looks less like an overgrown wagon than a Q7 does.
      I will back up my subjective statement with links to other subjective statements:

      Jalopnik says "It's a damn station wagon":
      http://truckyeah.jalopnik.com/2016-a...gon-1670262401

      Autoblog: "It resembles a tall station wagon more than ever, at least in European trim."
      http://www.autoblog.com/2015/05/22/2...#slide-3490334

      I could keep going on for days. Just google "Audi Q7 station wagon" and you will see it's frequently mentioned, how it looks more like a station wagon.
      I think it's the perceived low ground clearance (note, perceive, it's just the looks) and long butt. Even sitting in it, with the slightly lower seating position, feel not-SUVish to me. But again, it's feelings and looks...
      Last edited by VxF; 06-17-2017 at 10:41 AM.

    10. #8
      Quote Originally Posted by VxF View Post
      I will back up my subjective statement with links to other subjective statements:

      Jalopnik says "It's a damn station wagon":
      http://truckyeah.jalopnik.com/2016-a...gon-1670262401

      Autoblog: "It resembles a tall station wagon more than ever, at least in European trim."
      http://www.autoblog.com/2015/05/22/2...#slide-3490334

      I could keep going on for days. Just google "Audi Q7 station wagon" and you will see it's frequently mentioned, how it looks more like a station wagon.
      I think it's the perceived low ground clearance (note, perceive, it's just the looks) and long butt. Even sitting in it, with the slightly lower seating position, feel not-SUVish to me. But again, it's feelings and looks...
      I don't have a problem with it looking like a wagon. I don't agree with the negativity around wagons at all, and I'm glad they aren't considered to be something negative in Europe. And you're right, it's an observation made by many. But to my eyes, the Audi isn't the only SUV that resembles a wagon and I don't see where the xc90 is any less like a wagon in its profile. The Mercedes G has a wagon resemblance as well. And the GM Suburban and Escalade truly look like big wagons (mixed with trucks).

    11. #9
      Global Moderator GrecianVolvo's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by VxF View Post
      I
      I think it's the perceived low ground clearance (note, perceive, it's just the looks) and long butt. Even sitting in it, with the slightly lower seating position, feel not-SUVish to me. But again, it's feelings and looks...
      Other than the lower stance, it is the Q7's side body panels and hood/mask shape that make it look more like a car/station wagon vs an SUV.
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    12. #10
      Junior Member badcyclist's Avatar
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      The Q7 cargo area is pure station-wagon-- long, narrow, and low, with a smaller back hatch than other full-sized SUVs. Technically is has as much cargo area as the XC90, but it has far less usable space for dogs and other larger items. It's one of the reasons why I passed on it, although the fact that VW cheats and lies about their emission controls (can't even use past tense yet, because new stuff is continually coming out) was the clincher.
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    13. #11
      Junior Member Ivos's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by badcyclist View Post
      The Q7 cargo area is pure station-wagon-- long, narrow, and low, with a smaller back hatch than other full-sized SUVs. Technically is has as much cargo area as the XC90, but it has far less usable space for dogs and other larger items. It's one of the reasons why I passed on it,
      Yes, while it is a lot more quiet inside and has much more sophisticated suspension and ride, its cargo space is simply small comparing to XC90. XC90's cargo space is quite amazing ... and if you have 5 seats version like me, there are still quite substantial extra "secret" places below the cargo floor where you can put even more things
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    14. #12
      Quote Originally Posted by GrecianVolvo View Post
      Other than the lower stance, it is the Q7's side body panels and hood/mask shape that make it look more like a car/station wagon vs an SUV.
      From a traditionalist POV, the doesn't look like a station wagon in its proportions. Look at a 240 wagon.

      http://drivenwheels.com/wp-content/uploads/IMG_9462.jpg

      From the C to the D pillar, it's a long, long length for the cargo area. This area got shorter and shorter, but how short can it get to still be a station wagon? "Station" was dropped, and this body style was referred to as "wagon." But look at the Ford Flex or the Chevy Suburban, and it has that long cargo area, similar to the "traditional" "station wagon." They have that length between C and D pillars. That's what I'm looking at in viewing a "station" wagon vs. an SUV. And I think of plenty SUVs as a melding of a truck with an enclosed back that is "wagon" like. From the standpoint that the Audi Q7 is lower to the ground, yes, it doesn't give that raised SUV effect. But does a last-gen xc70 look like an SUV simply because it is raised? And even a tall CUV with a short cargo area (C to D) pillar, like the Subaru Forester, has a wagon-nish look about it.

      Ford Flex: https://media.ed.edmunds-media.com/f...oem_2_1280.jpg


      There's plenty debate at the linked sites in the comments on how much the Audi looks like a wagon.

      I guess it is all in how one perceives a wagon vs. an SUV. For me, many SUVs look like truck-wagons, or very tall, big wagons. Including the xc90, Mercedes G, Suburban and Escalade, while the xc60 has a shorter rear. The sloping of the back started to compromise the function of the wagons, and Volvo has gone for that to in the v90.

      So, depending on your perspective, the Audi is more station-wagon like or not, but I'd make an argument that it isn't really. It's just a lower SUV and follows Audi current design language, not much different in the way the xc90 does. But for others, it's definitely a station wagon. But now I understand the other perspective.
      Last edited by 02s80; 06-17-2017 at 01:21 PM.

    15. #13
      Quote Originally Posted by Ivos View Post
      Yes, while it is a lot more quiet inside and has much more sophisticated suspension and ride, its cargo space is simply small comparing to XC90. XC90's cargo space is quite amazing ... and if you have 5 seats version like me, there are still quite substantial extra "secret" places below the cargo floor where you can put even more things
      Volvo needs to step up the sound isolation and ride characteristics. Tired of reading that the Germans do both better.

    16. #14
      Quote Originally Posted by 02s80 View Post
      Volvo needs to step up the sound isolation and ride characteristics. Tired of reading that the Germans do both better.
      Damping on suspension and chassis is critical for noise muffling, while still keep it stiff. Hope they have better solution in new MY models.

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    18. #16
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      Quote Originally Posted by 02s80 View Post
      Volvo needs to step up the sound isolation and ride characteristics. Tired of reading that the Germans do both better.
      So am I, since I don't experience any of these issues. Sound isolation is very good and the ride is great.

    19. #17
      Junior Member badcyclist's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Zahra View Post
      So am I, since I don't experience any of these issues. Sound isolation is very good and the ride is great.
      +1
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    20. #18
      Quote Originally Posted by Zahra View Post
      So am I, since I don't experience any of these issues. Sound isolation is very good and the ride is great.
      Good to hear, especially as I'm a Volvo owner/fan. Did you test it against a new Q7?

      There was a comparison on here from an owner who had both SUVs. He pointed out strength and weaknesses of both, but overall, I got the impression that he found the Audi to be the better vehicle.

      However, I've read some owners who've had Mercedes that say the Volvo xc90 is just as good and they're impressed with it.

    21. #19
      Paradox here owns both and he said like XC90 more. So it is mostly personal preference.

    22. #20
      Junior Member badcyclist's Avatar
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      I drove both the Q7 and XC90. The Q7 was quieter, but both cars are very quiet (Car and Driver's db tests bear this out). The Q7 had more muscle starting from a dead stop, but I have only driven the T5, which doesn't have a supercharger. The differences in moving acceleration to pass was negligible, I thought-- or at least I expected a much greater difference. I much, much, much preferred the XC90 Sensus touchscreen display, despite some whining here. The Q7s touch pad is very awkward to use and archaic (I loathed it), and I thought that the software was dated, except for the virtual cockpit, which I loved, until I found out that you have to pay an outrageous monthly fee or it goes away.

      Cargo space and corporate culture I already noted.

      I thought the XC90's seats were more comfortable and I like their leather colors more, although the Q7 was fine. The XC90 seems light and roomy, while the Q7 seemed darker and more closed in, but not nearly as bad as the F-Pace on that score. Volvo's initial service terms are much better than Audi's. The XC90 cost $10,000 less at the time I purchased my car, which was not the primary decider, but it certainly helped confirm my decision to go with Volvo.
      Last edited by badcyclist; 06-19-2017 at 03:20 PM.
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    23. #21
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      Quote Originally Posted by 02s80 View Post
      Did you test it against a new Q7?
      No, I did not.
      In Belgium, the Q7 is only available with a diesel engine, I only buy cars with a petrol engine.
      Last edited by Zahra; 06-18-2017 at 03:20 AM.

    24. #22
      Junior Member Ivos's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by badcyclist View Post
      I drove both the Q7 and XC90. The Q7 was quieter, but both cars are very quiet (Car and Driver's db tests bear this out).
      Here it shows that T8 is just slightly more noisy than Q7, but D5 more than twice as much. It however concerns MY2015, MY 2017 is a bit quieter http://www.auto-decibel-db.com. The values I can measure in my car are about 2 dB lower than in that table
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    25. #23
      Junior Member Ivos's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Zahra View Post
      So am I, since I don't experience any of these issues. Sound isolation is very good and the ride is great.
      Do you have D5 or T6 ?
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    26. #24
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      Neither, it's a T5 and a 5-seater as well, but it only has 4 cylinders

    27. #25
      Junior Member Ivos's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Zahra View Post
      Neither, it's a T5 and a 5-seater as well, but it only has 4 cylinders
      So a petrol car. All XC90s are four cylinders
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    28. #26
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      Quote Originally Posted by Ivos View Post
      All XC90s are four cylinders
      I know, hence the smiley.
      My previous Volvo had 5 cylinders, but I can't say I miss any in this engine.

    29. #27
      Quote Originally Posted by stick_shift View Post
      I saw a pop-up add for a new vehicle, the VW Atlas. It certainly looks impressive and has a compelling price tag (a poor man's Q7?)

      I tried to go through the build tool but my web browser kept choking at the color selection stage. (perhaps they are inundated with curious shoppers?)

      Anyone else been able to look at the Atlas? How does it stack up to the XC90?

      Here:
      http://www.vw.com/models/atlas/
      The only thing I could see that the Atlas has over the XC90 is rear USB ports. Not sure why Volvo didn't include those with kids and all their devices nowadays.
      I was already super disappointed with the Q7...interior looks like my Jetta with a pop up screen and a digital display. The Atlas looks even more so like it but at least it doesn't have the Q7 price tag so maybe more justifiable.
      You can't beat the XC90 interior...even $90k Maserati SUV looks cheap compared to it.

    30. #28
      Global Moderator Paradox's Avatar
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      The only thing 'good' that I saw with the Atlas was during a commercial on TV they mentioned it comes with a 6 year 72,000 mile warranty period. Impressive compared to what other luxury vehicles generally come with. Hint hint Volvo and others.
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    31. #29
      Quote Originally Posted by carz View Post

      Yup, they are not in the same league in many ways. The Touareg is a VW Q7, despite the lack of 3rd row. (Full disclosure, I just bought a CPO Touareg due to their horrible residuals, after trying to find an XC90 for a price I could live with).

      Anyway, the 30k Atlas looks like a base model golf inside, the SEL trim with better seats, and other bits looks pretty decent, but just not in the same league as an XC90 at all (or a Q7 or Touareg for that matter).
      Still, pretty good for the money IMO. The comparable Honda Pilot (which I think is more the Atlas target) is comparably cheap inside.

    32. #30
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      I looked for over a year for a new car, doing OCD-level research on both the Q7 and the XC90. I wanted the Q7. At first I wanted the power of the Q7 because of the bragging rights/penis measuring from a sub-6 second 0-60. I would have bought the Q7, but it was roughly 7k more for the features that were must-haves for me (digital display, semi-autonomous driving, upgraded sound system).

      I went with the XC90 and now that I put polestar on it and did a few cosmetic mods, I'm quite happy with it in all ways but two- one: how slow the infotainment system boots up and responds (though the recent Sensus upgrade took care of some of that).

      But the one thing that I still don't like about the XC90 is not going away, and it has to do with the engine. The polestar really makes a huge difference in performance, but where the XC90 drops behind the Q7 and always will is actual noise from the engine. The supercharged V6 in the Q7 is so much quieter; the XC90 T6 revs so high and makes noise, and it's not fun noise like in my 328... it sounds like it's WORKING. The engine in the Q7 was almost silent unless you were gunning it, and unless you really wanted to blow off the line you never had to gun it. So in that sense I'd judge the Q7 to be an overall quieter car for jumping around town from light to light, though I have no complaints about how the XC90 sounds on long hauls.

    33. #31
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      Do you mean that the Q7 can be had without a digital display?

    34. #32
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      Yep- base trim it's not an option. Second trim it's an option (vision package). Highest trim it's standard.

    35. #33
      I think it looks SO much like an Explorer.
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