View Full Version : T8 in Pure Mode



AussieMikeD5
03-22-2015, 08:36 AM
I have been constantly reading about people wanting the T8 to drive on the electric motor only. I have been questioning the viability of this and mentioned it in a post a while back comparing the V60 PHEV to a Chevrolet Volt but thought I'd make a new post so the information is in one spot. Of all the reviews I've seen so far, there has been mention of it's capabilities to drive 25 miles on electricity but no one has actually done it and reported on it.

The electric motor is 60kW and 200Nm but is driving a vehicle that is 2200kg. What sort of driving are people anticipating of doing with this power? I guess in bumper to bumper traffic where you are hardly moving it can be used but accelerating from a set of traffic lights or onto a freeway will be embarrassing.

The VW e-up has basically the same power and torque as the T8 rear axle and takes 11.3 seconds to accelerate to 100km/h....... however the whole vehicle weighs in at under 1,100kg!!! I'm sure after driving it to and from work a few times it will become tedious and the pure mode will be changed to hybrid or power. Maybe a test drive of an e-up or V60 PHEV with 3 heavy blokes will give people a slightly closer comparison to the T8, but until one is available for a test drive in pure mode, wanting to buy this vehicle for that reason is very short sighted.

There are reasons why a T8 will work for some people and not others but I don't believe that driving in pure mode is one of them.

Regards,

Michael

goVolvo
03-22-2015, 09:28 AM
You can use power or hybrid mode to merge in highway then change to pure mode to follow the traffic. Pure mode does not mean it is the only mode to use.

Calhon
03-22-2015, 10:52 AM
There are reasons why a T8 will work for some people and not others but I don't believe that driving in pure mode is one of them.

I agree that, even if a trip is less than the assumed 25-mile electric range, it might not be possible to use electricity alone; depending on driving conditions and style. On the other hand, if a trip, or the combination of trips for the day, is more than 25 miles, it might be possible to travel 25 of the total miles on electricity alone. Either way, the ability to drive on electricity alone is an important part of the equation whether pure or the default hybrid mode is used.

Conradi
03-22-2015, 06:10 PM
Hi Michael,
Just out of curiosity, did you ever drive the V60 PIH? I’m not aware if it’s available in Australia. Two friends of my own V60 PIH’s and I’ve driven quite a lot with them.

Pure-mode is, beside the environmental aspects, simply a tremendous experience. You normally use it in city traffic only. The 0-100 km/h is not so important, because that will empty the batteries quite fast. Due to the direct torque characteristic of the e-motor the traffic-start is fantastic. At higher speeds, say above 50 km/h, (every) e-motor will lose due to the possible power compared to a combustion engine.
I’ve you want true performance switch to power were you start with the e-torque and the combustion engine takes over. On the web there’re are already a lot of videos showing the T8 performance.

Back to pure: you can’t simply compare it to the VW. Beside the size of the e-motor it’s also important if the batteries/power plant are capable of delivering enough electricity for full-power. Several competitors are simply reducing that due to cost savings. From the V60PIH we know that car is well equipped to accrual deliver the electric needed.

genericuser1
03-23-2015, 02:59 PM
You normally use it in city traffic only. The 0-100 km/h is not so important, because that will empty the batteries quite fast. Due to the direct torque characteristic of the e-motor the traffic-start is fantastic. At higher speeds, say above 50 km/h, (every) e-motor will lose due to the possible power compared to a combustion engine.
Iíve you want true performance switch to power were you start with the e-torque and the combustion engine takes over. On the web thereíre are already a lot of videos showing the T8 performance.

This is how I would envision using it. I'm going into the city for an event, I use the hybrid or save mode on the highway and switch over to pure mode once I'm downtown since city driving gives you the worst fuel economy.

AussieMikeD5
03-23-2015, 07:34 PM
The V60 PIH isn't available in Australia and I've never been in one. This thread has nothing to do the full performance of the XC90 T8, it is to detail the performance of driving purely on batteries for people who are looking to buy it thinking that they wont have to buy fuel. While 0-100 km/h is not important in city driving, the type of city driving in Australia is not always bumper to bumper 25 km/h max speed crawling along constantly. My drive to work consists of 20 km with around 15 traffic lights/stops accelerating from a standstill to 60 km/h. What is that acceleration time? What is the range of the car under that scenario? The specifications state a range of UP TO 25 miles (40km) in pure mode but like you said, hard acceleration from standstill will deplete the batteries quite fast. The XC90 is another 300kg heavier than the V60 PIH along with much wider tyres and most probably a higher rolling resistance.

While the VW e-up might not have the capabilities to repetitively deliver the electricity for full power, it would be possible for one acceleration from 0-100 km/h to set a time. My point is that the T8 is twice the weight of the e-up with the same electrical power and torque, the acceleration time for the T8 in pure mode will be slower than the e-up. A 0-60 km/h test for the V60 PIH will give a closer indication of the T8 but as a guess, I think it will still take almost 10 seconds to reach 60 km/h.

Don't get me wrong, the T8 will be a good thing for many people irrespective of this topic but unless your daily commute meets those certain conditions, driving just in pure mode will get boring very quickly.

Regards,

Michael

T5_awd
03-24-2015, 02:51 AM
0-60 km/h in the V60 D6 PIH takes about 8.5s.

Calhon
03-24-2015, 11:42 AM
Don't get me wrong, the T8 will be a good thing for many people irrespective of this topic but unless your daily commute meets those certain conditions, driving just in pure mode will get boring very quickly.

Pure mode's purpose is to support the driver when he wants to maximize mileage on electricity. The electric motor has enough power for the low to moderate accelerations and speeds that the driver would use under such circumstances. Spirited driving isn't consistent with a goal to minimize energy consumption. There's Hybrid and power modes for that.

If the driver demands more power than the electric motor can supply, my understanding is the gasoline engine will automatically engage, even in Pure mode. So it's not like you have to manually switch modes for brief demands for extra power.

Conradi
03-24-2015, 12:30 PM
This thread has nothing to do the full performance of the XC90 T8, it is to detail the performance of driving purely on batteries for people who are looking to buy it thinking that they wont have to buy fuel. While 0-100 km/h is not important in city driving, the type of city driving in Australia is not always bumper to bumper 25 km/h max speed crawling along constantly. My drive to work consists of 20 km with around 15 traffic lights/stops accelerating from a standstill to 60 km/h. What is that acceleration time? What is the range of the car under that scenario? The specifications state a range of UP TO 25 miles (40km) in pure mode but like you said, hard acceleration from standstill will deplete the batteries quite fast. The XC90 is another 300kg heavier than the V60 PIH along with much wider tyres and most probably a higher rolling resistance.

To be honest, we all don’t know because nobody could really test it. I’m one of the earliest T8 buyers, and have to wait until October to drive it. In your case; will all traffic lights be red, what will be the ambient temperature, how fast/slow do you accelerate? It all influence the battery level.
I believe you will end-up the best in the standard hybrid mode. While the e-motor will take care of the take-off acceleration you will you use very less fuel only to keep the vehicle at constant speed till the next traffic light. That we already know from the V60 PIH.

By-the-way I only mentioned the T8 performance to make clear the e-motor is good for start-off and up to 50 km/h, the combustion will take over.

T5_awd
03-24-2015, 04:11 PM
I’m one of the earliest T8 buyers, and have to wait until October to drive it.

OT, but are you sure about October? I've heard today that the production starts week 28. So a lot earlier than than what they changed to before.

Conradi
03-24-2015, 04:18 PM
Ok, that's really good news!

Until so far it was stated the production of the T8 would start in wk34. My dealer informed me my car would be build wk36.
Anyway, we wait and we will see :rolleyes:

AussieMikeD5
03-24-2015, 07:50 PM
Pure mode's purpose is to support the driver when he wants to maximize mileage on electricity. If the driver demands more power than the electric motor can supply, my understanding is the gasoline engine will automatically engage, even in Pure mode.

That is correct however to me, it seems the acceleration will be too slow with full power from the electric motor but driving just on Pure mode requires acceleration to be less than it's maximum otherwise the petrol engine will engage.


To be honest, we all don’t know because nobody could really test it. I’m one of the earliest T8 buyers, and have to wait until October to drive it. In your case; will all traffic lights be red, what will be the ambient temperature, how fast/slow do you accelerate? It all influence the battery level.
I believe you will end-up the best in the standard hybrid mode. While the e-motor will take care of the take-off acceleration you will you use very less fuel only to keep the vehicle at constant speed till the next traffic light. That we already know from the V60 PIH.

By-the-way I only mentioned the T8 performance to make clear the e-motor is good for start-off and up to 50 km/h, the combustion will take over.

Doesn't the T8 have the same battery pack and electric motor as the V60? What about driving when there is no other traffic as we have just been talking about stop/start city driving? What about driving in snow over a large distance where you need awd the whole time? A T8 won't work for me as I do a fair bit of towing and long distance driving and a combination of long distance driving while towing so I'll be getting a D5 R Design.

The way I look at it is while it is possible to drive purely on electricity, the conditions and performance will make the vehicle extremely boring to use in Pure mode.

Regards,

Michael

T5_awd
03-25-2015, 10:35 AM
Ok, that's really good news!

Until so far it was stated the production of the T8 would start in wk34. My dealer informed me my car would be build wk36.
Anyway, we wait and we will see :rolleyes:

Today my T8 delivery week was changed from late Feb 2016 to mid Nov 2015. :) Hopefully it will be changed at least one more time in the right direction!

Conradi
03-26-2015, 02:31 PM
Doesn't the T8 have the same battery pack and electric motor as the V60? What about driving when there is no other traffic as we have just been talking about stop/start city driving? What about driving in snow over a large distance where you need awd the whole time? A T8 won't work for me as I do a fair bit of towing and long distance driving and a combination of long distance driving while towing so I'll be getting a D5 R Design.

The way I look at it is while it is possible to drive purely on electricity, the conditions and performance will make the vehicle extremely boring to use in Pure mode.
No, the T8 has a different e-topology. Beside different batteries and e-motor, it also has for the first time the starter-generator (CISG). This generator is so powerful it can directly drive the e-motor when the battery is empty. So the T8 has always AWD available.
You’re entitle to have your own opinion about pure-mode. I can only advise you to try it out when available because it’s really an exciting experience and definite not ‘extremely boring’ :)

In your case I would go for the Diesel either, because long distance driving and towing is not the optimal environment for a hybrid. By-the-way, I’ll tow a large caravan (2000 kg / 4400 lbs) during the holiday and that will make the T8 thirsty.
I drive a lot mixed mode, both city-drive and small (80 km/50 m) distances and that suits the T8 very well.