Volvo's new Drive-E and oil change intervals - Page 3
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    1. #71
      Global Moderator GrecianVolvo's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by VolvoFaRmeR View Post
      Yes, and assistant service manager for a few years as well as long as parts manager. I've seen hundreds and hundreds of S/V/C70's roll through the door, along with all the P2 products, many way over 100,000 miles. We always followed the factory recommended schedule as did 99% of our customers. I've seen PCV systems clogged at 50,000 miles and I've seen PVC systems never service as 250,000 miles. I've seen 3000 mile service intervals on 850's with clogged PCV....and some with 100,000+ with no PCV problems. I've seen the same for 7,500 mile service intervals, and you will see it at 10,000 as well.

      All of these examples of failures can be contradicted by another example of someone that has the exact opposite experience. Do what you feel comfortable with...I'll stick with 10,000 intervals, just as I follow the doubled service intervals on my John Deere equipment. It's been proven over and over again. You can have a million examples of stories about oil samples....I just want to roll my eyes.... Everything breaks, sometimes on your car, sometimes on your neighbors cars. But if you think you are able to determine what is and isn't proper for oil changes more so than the engineers that made it (along with all of these other engines made by other brands), well.....that's pretty bold in my opinion. If you are a service advisor and you live in cars and car repairs, you get a real eye opening about real world examples.....
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    3. #72
      Senior Member Johann's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Mrsideways View Post
      The Amount of Mini's I change turbo's on with 50k miles on the clock is astounding.
      Not all engine's are equal. Volvo has a problem child themselves, the D2 Peugeot engine. Also a turbo consumer. I believe they changed the oil recommendations for this engine at least 3 times. Some engine's clog more than others. Some oil clog more than others. Driving style is also a part of it. I think the biggest issue at the moment is the "new driving" as it is called where it is recommended to shift to the tallest gear as soon as possible preventing the crank from "properly floating on oil." No load on the engine is killing also. An engine needs to burn clean every now and then.
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    4. #73
      Member matt1122's Avatar
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      Thank you, Farmer. I was wanting to say that PCV can have nothing to do with OCI, but didn't know how to support it. =P
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    6. #74
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      Quote Originally Posted by VolvoFaRmeR View Post
      Yes, and assistant service manager for a few years as well as long as parts manager. I've seen hundreds and hundreds of S/V/C70's roll through the door, along with all the P2 products, many way over 100,000 miles. We always followed the factory recommended schedule as did 99% of our customers. I've seen PCV systems clogged at 50,000 miles and I've seen PVC systems never service as 250,000 miles. I've seen 3000 mile service intervals on 850's with clogged PCV....and some with 100,000+ with no PCV problems. I've seen the same for 7,500 mile service intervals, and you will see it at 10,000 as well.

      All of these examples of failures can be contradicted by another example of someone that has the exact opposite experience. Do what you feel comfortable with...I'll stick with 10,000 intervals, just as I follow the doubled service intervals on my John Deere equipment. It's been proven over and over again. You can have a million examples of stories about oil samples....I just want to roll my eyes.... Everything breaks, sometimes on your car, sometimes on your neighbors cars. But if you think you are able to determine what is and isn't proper for oil changes more so than the engineers that made it (along with all of these other engines made by other brands), well.....that's pretty bold in my opinion. If you are a service advisor and you live in cars and car repairs, you get a real eye opening about real world examples.....
      I began in the parts department and then became a mechanic at my local Volvo dealership and then later work as a mechanic at a GM dealership. So I'd say too have a good perspective of car reliability/longevity as it relates to maintenance. Also I've never seen a low mileage car (anything under 50,000 miles) with a clogged PCV so I have to call your bluff on that one as well as the claim about the 250,000 mile cars never needing a PCV system replacement. If that is true then those were not Volvos of the P2 era or newer.

      To be blunt the vast majority of service adviser and managers I've worked with at multiple dealerships knew very little about the inner workings of an engine or much else in the car. So forgive me if I don't hold your opinion in high regard. You're obviously welcome to do the same with my opinion.

      My position on maintenance is based on multiple factors including automotive technical education, real world experience as a technician as well as my experiences as an owner, continued research, current connections in the industry etc. And all of that plus common sense tells me that yes, I know better than to follow the manufacturers guidelines on how to maintain my car. They probably know as well as I do what is really required to keep these cars going for a long time with proper maintenance but they have many reasons to prescribe the bare minimum of service. Call me bold if you will but I call it using my education, knowledge and experience.

      And yes OCIs have just about everything to do with how long your PCV system will last. They also effect how long other important engine components will last such as cam and cranks seals, valve steam seals and of course the rear main seal.

      I offer up my opinion and experience on the subject of maintenance to try to help others that are trying to get the most out of their cars.

      If you want to experiment with long OCIs on your new car I wish you good luck because nothing has been proven yet. How many Drive-e engines have you heard of with 100,000 miles + of real world driving?
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    7. #75
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      Quote Originally Posted by matt1122 View Post
      Thank you, Farmer. I was wanting to say that PCV can have nothing to do with OCI, but didn't know how to support it. =P
      This couldn't be further from the truth.
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    8. #76
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      Quote Originally Posted by Major Error View Post
      FWIW, on my previous 2 Ford engines, the first was rock-solid for the 140K I put on it over 8 years with regular 5k changes of dino oil. The second spun a bearing at only 98k miles on full synthetic every 5k.

      Modern engineering/manufacturing methods and materials-science have produced more-powerful and more-reliable products, but they're far from perfect--there *will* be failures, and they *will not* be evenly distributed.
      I totally agree with you. You can do everything right and still run into big problems. That being said the same vehicle will last longer with better maintenance than without. That is obvious.
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    9. #77
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      Quote Originally Posted by geokilla View Post
      There's no dipstick.



      FWIW, my S70's PCV is still solid and I never had the PCV serviced. My mechanic friend did the glove test for me and it was perfectly fine. The S70 gets 5000km oil changes with regular oil, 10,000km oil changes with synthetic oil. I just mix and match with whatever is on sale. You may disagree with my method here, but I honestly don't care that much. No engine leaks, no nothing so it's good enough for me. The engine is the last thing that would go judging from the noise (or lack of), as the car would probably be traded first before the engine goes. Even my suspension is starting to go, with that stupid rear trailing arm.

      He did say that it is usually the turbocharged cars that have PCV problem.
      My Volvo tech buddy said the same to my Dad when he recently brought in his S70 and had him check crankcase pressure. The tech said the PCV system tested fine. I tested it myself using the glove test and my result was that there was little to no vacuum. So I went ahead and ordered a PCV kit and replaced it for my Dad. In doing so I found out exactly why the system didn't show positive pressure (which is what the tech was looking for to red flag the PCV system) the main PCV pipe that wraps around the engine block was broken in 3 places allowing the pressure to escape and not show up when tested from the dipstick tube.

      After I finished replacing the PCV system and cleaning the block ports and PTC nipple I retested the system and sure enough there was good strong vacuum trying to suck the glove in. Needless to say my Dad was very pleased as well was I.

      That's just one more example of why you can't always trust technicians/advisers/ etc. There was obviously no malicious intent as the tech is a personal friend but nonetheless he was wrong.
      David - '01 S60 T5 GT 205K+ miles OWNED SINCE DAY ONE - Bilstein Sport + TME, ipd sway bar + endlinks, UR chassis braces (upper F+R), Powerslot /Akebono pads, Snabb Intake, iMIV Original engine, transmission replaced at 78k miles
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    10. #78
      Member Okidiver's Avatar
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      Read this entire thread to see if someone figured out how to check oil level on one of the new DriveE engines...alas...
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    11. #79
      Member matt1122's Avatar
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      Okidiver, I believe it's on the trip computer.
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    12. #80
      We've been using digital dipsticks for quite some time now...this is nothing new and it works fine. FYI my 2005 Volvo semi truck has a digital oil level readout, and it works great and is extremely accurate, as it tells you exactly how much below (in gallons, of course) from completely full to the add mark you are. Here the oil is easily checked every day at initial start up, something I doubt the vast majority of owners do now with a dipstick.

    13. #81
      Member Okidiver's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by matt1122 View Post
      Okidiver, I believe it's on the trip computer.
      Maybe on other models, but not in my '15. Pages 235 and 237 in the owner's manual state all I get is, "Shows the number of months and mileage until the next scheduled service." And that's all I got.

      There's gotta be a SECRET button/knob/lever/handle/sign-of-the-cross/secret handshake combination to get the oil level on these drive-e engines...
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    14. #82
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      Quote Originally Posted by VolvoFaRmeR View Post
      We've been using digital dipsticks for quite some time now...this is nothing new and it works fine. FYI my 2005 Volvo semi truck has a digital oil level readout, and it works great and is extremely accurate, as it tells you exactly how much below (in gallons, of course) from completely full to the add mark you are. Here the oil is easily checked every day at initial start up, something I doubt the vast majority of owners do now with a dipstick.
      I agree that it is easy to check, generally very reliable in its accuracy (as best we can tell without having a dipstick backup to be exact) and performs checks more often than the typical driver. I do miss being able to see the condition of my oil and use it as an indicator of things that could be wrong - water or particles in the oil comes to mind. Obviously this is not a Volvo only issue as the German manufacturers have done this for a generation or 2 of vehicles already. I would liken this to the loss of spare tires - just a part of vehicle "evolution" as things we used to be accustomed to are automated out.

      As far as the OP and the original question - basically we all pay our $ for the cars, do whatever maintenance you want. I may do more often than others and some do way less than me, to each his own.

    15. #83
      Member matt1122's Avatar
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      I see it's not in the manual. But check anyway. When sjmcars showed me on the 2015 Drive-E he had at Carlisle, he pressed OK on the stalk and then scrolled and found an oil-related option.
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      Electronic Dipstick Operation

      Quote Originally Posted by matt1122 View Post
      I see it's not in the manual. But check anyway. When sjmcars showed me on the 2015 Drive-E he had at Carlisle, he pressed OK on the stalk and then scrolled and found an oil-related option.
      Here is a supplement to the XC60 manual that our dealer gave us. Hope it helps.
      [IMG]Owner_information_oil_level_VEP_EN by tonyjag06, on Flickr[/IMG]
      As i have posted, I miss having the ability to see, feel, and smell the oil off the end of the dipstick. But there may be a workaround..if you do it before all the oil has drained off, you should be able to stick a finger or swab into the oil filler and collect a bit of oil off the cam.

      But the Aisin 8-speed transaxle has no dipstick..conventional or electronic... so I still don't know how you are supposed to check the ATF level.
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      If I remember right, Grecian can probably tell us for sure, the vehicles now rely on a warning light on dash when the sensor detects transmission fluid level low. Also I think it's considered sealed and lubed for life - although on ipd website you can find a kit where you can tie into the transmission cooler to change it. I think it's full when it trickles out of the drain plug, it's a type of overfill drain plug. It has been a few years since we did it on the xc90 and didn't do it on the S40 or S60 so my memory is a bit hazy on exact details!

    18. #86
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      Excellent, thanks for posting the secret supplement. Will check today to see if it works on my V60. Not that it matters--last car I owned that burned oil was...my '70 Monte Carlo?
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      They work just fine

      Quote Originally Posted by JRL View Post
      A brand new drivetrain system with a 10K oil change!!!!???
      I don't think I would want to be a guinea pig on this.

      5K with synthetic and you can't go wrong.
      We can see in a few years how these 10K oil changes work out for owners who keep their cars a long time
      I had an XC90 and changed the oil every 10K for 260,000 miles with no issues. When I sold it, was still going strong, just got tired of it. Also Saab 9-5, oil changes every 10K for 130,000 miles so far, with no issues. XC60, 10K oil changes now with 85,000 miles on it, no issues.

      So yes, it works out just fine.

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      Drive-e engines require a5/b5 oil, the spec one of the requirements for which is stability over extended period of time. There's close to 6 quarts of oil in this small engine without timing chain. This means 10K OCI is likely safe for 99.99%. Is it safe for you? The only way to tell is performing used oil analysis. Everything else is a matter of one's religion (can or can't believe it's safe ).
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    21. #89
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      Quote Originally Posted by jaynlisa View Post
      I had an XC90 and changed the oil every 10K for 260,000 miles with no issues. When I sold it, was still going strong, just got tired of it. Also Saab 9-5, oil changes every 10K for 130,000 miles so far, with no issues. XC60, 10K oil changes now with 85,000 miles on it, no issues.

      So yes, it works out just fine.
      That's great but I'm sure that you drove mostly highway miles to rack up that kind of mileage. Highway miles are much much easier on engines and oil.
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    22. #90
      Senior Member Warpedcow's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by T501 View Post
      That's great but I'm sure that you drove mostly highway miles to rack up that kind of mileage. Highway miles are much much easier on engines and oil.
      If you're only doing city driving you will probably hit the one-year OCI before the 10K mile OCI...
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    23. #91
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      I drive mostly back roads and some highway. Round trip 60 miles to work. I use AMSOIL 5w30 Synthetic and change my oil every 7,500 miles. It worked on my 2004 S60R which I sold at 192,000 miles and it only used 1/4 quart of oil between changes.
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      I still cant get the digital Oil gauge to work. I've mimicked the instructions exactly and its still greyed out.
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      Your engine needs to be off, car is accessory mode (press and hold the engine start button without foot on brake).

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      Quote Originally Posted by adk793 View Post
      Your engine needs to be off, car is accessory mode (press and hold the engine start button without foot on brake).
      And don't forget this bit... "The system cannot detect changes in the oil level immediately. The vehicle must be driven approximately 20 miles (30 km) or have been parked on level ground with the engine off for 5 minutes before the oil level reading will be correct."

      The problem is that the oil level is only an idiot light. It's either full or there's an error in which case you'll be notified via the dash. There's not much point of checking the level.
      Last edited by SilverRubicon; 05-31-2016 at 08:53 PM.
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      Oil changes T5 E drive

      Quote Originally Posted by koffinb View Post
      Ok so I would suspect that an engine with both a supercharger and a turbocharger would need to have its oil changed a lot more frequently than Volvo's guidelines of 10,000 miles correct? Who else agrees with me? I haven't seen anyone shed any light on this topic, but this just seems like a recipe for early engine failure..all the heat from both components will definitely take a serious toll on the engine oil.
      2015.5, turbo only, change oil every 7500km, approx 4500 miles. Have approx 13000 miles on car. Use Shell hi test nitro exclusively. Average approx 7.5 L per 100 km. I am v happy with that. Time will tell if this scenario works.

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      How to check oil on digital gauges - a how-to after much trying myself:
      -Park car on level surface
      -Leave it off for a while (let's say min two hours) and walk away
      -Come back to your car, foot off the gas and brake push and hold the START button until you get to the "accessory 2" position. The car will chime to let you know. It will not work if you just push START or don't hold it down long enough to get the Acc2.
      -Now that you're in Acc2 you can check your electronic dipstick through the steering wheel stalk.

    29. #97
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      Quote Originally Posted by Savedsol View Post
      How to check oil on digital gauges - a how-to after much trying myself:
      -Park car on level surface
      -Leave it off for a while (let's say min two hours) and walk away
      -Come back to your car, foot off the gas and brake push and hold the START button until you get to the "accessory 2" position. The car will chime to let you know. It will not work if you just push START or don't hold it down long enough to get the Acc2.
      -Now that you're in Acc2 you can check your electronic dipstick through the steering wheel stalk.
      For Volvo to have purposely made this so difficult to do is ridiculous.
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      Back to the Thread Topic: For a small hot turbo (and super charged) engine like this to go 10K miles between full synthetic oil changes is inane IMHO. For good longevity/reliability, this should be 5K miles max. A factory/dealer installed Oil Catch Can (OCC) should also be installed and drained at every OCI.
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      Quote Originally Posted by whizkid View Post
      Back to the Thread Topic: For a small hot turbo (and super charged) engine like this to go 10K miles between full synthetic oil changes is inane IMHO. For good longevity/reliability, this should be 5K miles max. A factory/dealer installed Oil Catch Can (OCC) should also be installed and drained at every OCI.
      Please show a picture of this OCC; where does it mount and what does it protect against?

      See this thread regarding oil change: How to Change Drive-E T6 (and T5?) Oil https://forums.swedespeed.com/showthr...-(and-T5-)-Oil
      2015 XC60 DRIVE-E T6, Platinum, Heated F. Seats, Crystal White Met, Xenon, Tech, BLIS
      Custom: Valentine mount/City Safety IR filter, Dog Seat, Superchager ind., REAL dipstick
      2002 Acura RSX Type-S 6 speed
      2020 Tesla Model 3 Performance

    32. #100
      Junior Member
      Join Date
      Feb 2014
      Location
      Central Mass.
      Posts
      882

      Smile Add a real dipstick!

      Quote Originally Posted by whizkid View Post
      For Volvo to have purposely made this so difficult to do is ridiculous.
      I agree with all of the negative comments on the electronic dipstick. And after all that hassle, it only reads to the nearest Litre. That's why I built my own REAL dipstick. See https://forums.swedespeed.com/showthr...Question/page4
      You can build one too!
      2015 XC60 DRIVE-E T6, Platinum, Heated F. Seats, Crystal White Met, Xenon, Tech, BLIS
      Custom: Valentine mount/City Safety IR filter, Dog Seat, Superchager ind., REAL dipstick
      2002 Acura RSX Type-S 6 speed
      2020 Tesla Model 3 Performance

    33. #101
      Junior Member whizkid's Avatar
      Join Date
      Sep 2014
      Location
      Knoxville, TN
      Posts
      462
      Quote Originally Posted by TonyJag View Post
      Please show a picture of this OCC; where does it mount and what does it protect against?

      See this thread regarding oil change: How to Change Drive-E T6 (and T5?) Oil https://forums.swedespeed.com/showthr...-(and-T5-)-Oil
      I have one I installed on my other car ('12 Optima SX turbo). I just wish SOMEBODY had one (or Volvo for that matter) to install on these Drive-E 2.0L engines.

      As for what I have installed, I can share a link to it:

      http://www.saikoumichi.com/

      You will need to research on what OCC can do for engines (especially the blown variety) on the inter-webs.
      (SOLD) 2007 S80 3.2L FWD (BD: 11/06)| Willow Green | 218K miles @ 9/2017
      Mods: IPD Alu Skid Plate | 25% tint | Qwik-Valve F104S + ADP-104 | MagnaFlow Mufflers (#11225) w/Stainless tips | GC Edge 0W-40 oil | Continental PureContact tires (225/50R17) on 17" Regor rims.

    34. #102
      Junior Member whizkid's Avatar
      Join Date
      Sep 2014
      Location
      Knoxville, TN
      Posts
      462
      Quote Originally Posted by whizkid View Post
      I have one I installed on my other car ('12 Optima SX turbo). I just wish SOMEBODY had one (or Volvo for that matter) to install on these Drive-E 2.0L engines.

      As for what I have installed, I can share a link to it:

      http://www.saikoumichi.com/

      You will need to research on what OCC can do for engines (especially the blown variety) on the inter-webs.
      Excellent DIY oil change write up BTW!
      (SOLD) 2007 S80 3.2L FWD (BD: 11/06)| Willow Green | 218K miles @ 9/2017
      Mods: IPD Alu Skid Plate | 25% tint | Qwik-Valve F104S + ADP-104 | MagnaFlow Mufflers (#11225) w/Stainless tips | GC Edge 0W-40 oil | Continental PureContact tires (225/50R17) on 17" Regor rims.

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