Audio Alerts when Adaptive Cruise Control Disengage - Same as Pilot Assist?
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    1. #1
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      Audio Alerts when Adaptive Cruise Control Disengage - Same as Pilot Assist?

      My wife has yet to "embrace" Pilot Assist and drives on the freeway with Adaptive Cruise Control. As a passenger, I hear a "bell" alarm when it disengages, but when I drive, I hear no "audio" alarm when Pilot Assist disengages.

      Is there an "AUDIO ALERT" if Pilot Assist stops? And if so, where is the setting (I studied the manual before posting, but can't find it, and the "profile" settings appear to be the same between her and me).


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    3. #2
      Junior Member mferranti's Avatar
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      I've heard a signal tone when Pilot Assist has disengaged. Don't know it there's setting for it.
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    4. #3
      Junior Member HoustonEaDo's Avatar
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      My "donged" yesterday when it disengaged - also showed an alert in HUD and by the speedometer
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    6. #4
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      There is an audible alert when pilot assist disengages due to inactivity but, AFAIK, it's silent when it turns off because it can't read lane markings. It'd be *very* nice to have it alert the driver in both cases.

    7. #5
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      Repeat again,

      Put your paws on steering as it will vibrate when it disengages.

      Drive with hand and eyes, not ears. Car is a very noisy box.

      Sent from my Z978 using Tapatalk
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    8. #6
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      This behaviour was changed with one of the software updates. Mine was silent before, but it warned when disengaging after the update.

    9. #7
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      When Pilot Assist disengages on my 2019 due to not being able to read lane markings there is no audible warning and the steering wheel does not vibrate. The only way I know it has disengaged is to look at the dash to see that the yellow steering wheel below the speedometer is now greyed out.
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    10. #8
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      Quote Originally Posted by FusionRedXC60 View Post
      Repeat again,

      Put your paws on steering as it will vibrate when it disengages.

      Drive with hand and eyes, not ears. Car is a very noisy box.

      Sent from my Z978 using Tapatalk
      While I'm usually against additional updates, the disengagement of driving assistance is absolutely something that warrants an audio alert.

      I *am* keeping my eyes on the road, not watching a tiny green icon shift to gray. And like countryguy, I've never noticed a steering wheel vibration when Pilot Assist turns off. Am I going to wreck because of this? I mean no, but it's always jarring when I'm expecting the car to have started a turn then I have to quickly take over.

      It seems inconsistent that Volvo provides an audio alert when you've been interfering with Pilot Assist too much (so you're clearly well engaged) versus when it simply cannot accurately predict conditions.

    11. #9
      Junior Member RootDKJ's Avatar
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      I don’t have any issues with the how Pilot Assist disengages. I probably would not hear it over the B&W anyway...
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    12. #10
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      Quote Originally Posted by ssskelton View Post
      While I'm usually against additional updates, the disengagement of driving assistance is absolutely something that warrants an audio alert.

      I *am* keeping my eyes on the road, not watching a tiny green icon shift to gray. And like countryguy, I've never noticed a steering wheel vibration when Pilot Assist turns off. Am I going to wreck because of this? I mean no, but it's always jarring when I'm expecting the car to have started a turn then I have to quickly take over.

      It seems inconsistent that Volvo provides an audio alert when you've been interfering with Pilot Assist too much (so you're clearly well engaged) versus when it simply cannot accurately predict conditions.
      As mentioned in posts above, the steering vibration is added fairly recent, within a year or so. I don't remember exact update, maybe last Nov or last May.

      I think the reason is that losing track of lane marks is an event too late to send audible alarm to an inattentive driver. So the car already gave up on the driver. Steering vibration is better as your hand on steering wheel can feel it and intuitively hold it steady. Driver pressing gas pedal for 1+ minute is a moment that is safe to give alarm, as driver is active.
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    13. #11
      Junior Member PSamy's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by RootDKJ View Post
      I don’t have any issues with the how Pilot Assist disengages. I probably would not hear it over the B&W anyway...

      Any audible alerts from the cars ( including navigation) subdues / silences the audio system while it alerts, I don't think B&W is an exception. I may be wrong, I don't have B&W.
      Last edited by PSamy; 11-12-2019 at 03:07 PM.
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    14. #12
      Junior Member PSamy's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by ssskelton View Post
      While I'm usually against additional updates, the disengagement of driving assistance is absolutely something that warrants an audio alert.

      I *am* keeping my eyes on the road, not watching a tiny green icon shift to gray. And like countryguy, I've never noticed a steering wheel vibration when Pilot Assist turns off. Am I going to wreck because of this? I mean no, but it's always jarring when I'm expecting the car to have started a turn then I have to quickly take over.

      It seems inconsistent that Volvo provides an audio alert when you've been interfering with Pilot Assist too much (so you're clearly well engaged) versus when it simply cannot accurately predict conditions.
      I had Tesla Model X for few months and it was equipped with first gen autopilot , it had clear distinct audible alert while the autopilot disengages. I don't have to see the dashboard to see if the autopilot is active or not.
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    15. #13
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      Quote Originally Posted by FusionRedXC60 View Post
      As mentioned in posts above, the steering vibration is added fairly recent, within a year or so. I don't remember exact update, maybe last Nov or last May.

      I think the reason is that losing track of lane marks is an event too late to send audible alarm to an inattentive driver. So the car already gave up on the driver. Steering vibration is better as your hand on steering wheel can feel it and intuitively hold it steady. Driver pressing gas pedal for 1+ minute is a moment that is safe to give alarm, as driver is active.
      I looked at the release notes, and it appears the change was April 2019:
      Improved feedback for Pilot Assist. Under certain conditions, the steering wheel vibrates slightly when Pliot Assist steering assistance is disconnected, adaptive cruise control remains active. The same vibration as for lane assist is used when the car is about to leave its lane.

      I still believe that consistency is the best policy with these types of critical functions. Regardless of why Pliot Assist disengages, having a consistent audio "message" along with the vibration to deliver that shut off alert would be best. The display can provide the specifics. There are really very few things more critical to know than "your car isn't driving itself any more", so I don't know why they'd be reluctant here.

    16. #14
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      Quote Originally Posted by ssskelton View Post
      I looked at the release notes, and it appears the change was April 2019:



      I still believe that consistency is the best policy with these types of critical functions. Regardless of why Pliot Assist disengages, having a consistent audio "message" along with the vibration to deliver that shut off alert would be best. The display can provide the specifics. There are really very few things more critical to know than "your car isn't driving itself any more", so I don't know why they'd be reluctant here.
      Because your car doesn't drive by itself and this is by design. It is driving assist only.
      You shouldn't think / assume your car drives by itself, and shouldn't give up your control or monitoring in the first place.

      Consistency is good for consistent events at similar urgency level.
      Anyhow, losing track of lane mark is a special event. When it happens driver should be in control already. If it is on a curve, your arm muscle should be already applying steering force. Yes, this is required. You can easily see how critical this is to keep you on track on curves with fading lane marks. Driver can't wait for an alarm then respond.
      Last edited by FusionRedXC60; 11-12-2019 at 04:42 PM.
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    17. #15
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      Quote Originally Posted by PSamy View Post
      I had Tesla Model X for few months and it was equipped with first gen autopilot , it had clear distinct audible alert while the autopilot disengages. I don't have to see the dashboard to see if the autopilot is active or not.
      Tesla drivers were involved in more accidents under AP mode than Volvo. I don't see why Tesla is doing it better.

      If those Tesla drives weren't relying on the audible alert, maybe he could have avoid the accident.
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    18. #16
      Junior Member BertL's Avatar
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      For me, as a 4-year Model S owner with AutoPilot — I only used it for driver’s assist with my staying in complete control, and never once played stupid games some do trying to make it into something it’s not. That being said, I’m all about consistency in a UI, that does not annoy me, but helps me be more prepared to react IF there is something I can do about it. I don’t want the UI to sound alarms for everything, every time. In general terms, if I turn an automated system ON, and for some reason the vehicle decides to turn it OFF, I want to know it did that. OTOH, if it’s an automated system that is just there behind the scenes all the time, the vehicle is more than welcome to just do it’s thing and not notify me each and every time it engages/disengages (e.g. anti-lock brakes or perhaps some other safety systems.)

      While I’ve not yet taken delivery of my T8, my test drive impression was Volvo does a good job with consistency and trying to balance when messages appear or tones are sounded. I would think with Volvo’s long safety focus, that’s probably part of the DNA attempting to balance too many and what type of notifications so the important things don’t become white noise the driver will ignore. I’ll have to see how all the optional driver assist tools my new T8 will provide operate. My hope remains — if I turn a driver assist system on, and the car decides to turn it off, it better tell me some way that is obvious — otherwise even though I remain in control, I may consider the “assist” system is still active when it’s not, and that in itself could pose a problem, IDK.

      For non-Tesla owners, it’s probably important to recognize a Tesla uses a very visual presentation in the IC (or the single display in a Model 3) to represent what’s going on around the vehicle, and that presentation is enhanced further when AP is enabled:
      • If you have AP installed, and even if it’s not enabled by the driver, the IC always shows the lane limits on either side of your vehicle. That’s true for all levels of AP. You can always tell if AP is able to actually see lane lines, curbs, etc or not on either side of you. (E.g. as you cross an intersection, they will briefly disappear because the road markings are not there until you get to the other side.) I believe with the recent introduction of cones that came in with an OTA update in the last 2-3 weeks for owners of the latest AP HW, construction cones appear and disappear in a similar manner. The IC also always shows surrounding vehicles and tries to visually distinguish large trucks and motorcycles from other vehicles around you.
      • When AP is enabled by the driver, a sound is generated, along with a continuous visual IC indication it’s in operation.
      • When AP wants your attention, there is a message or other visual indication in the IC — albeit, I didn’t see them some times because my eyes were more focused on the road ahead.
      • When AP wants more of your attention, or for things like going out of your lane, it may additionally vibrate the steering wheel — albeit that may or not be as noticeable to the driver of any vehicle given how tightly they are holding the wheel and if the road is bumpy to begin with (when you just may not notice the difference). My personal view is the whole vibration thing is a supplemental notification method — it’s just too easy to not notice it happening unless you have a really good road surface and are more tightly holding the steering wheel.
      • If AP disengages itself or the driver manually turns it off with the stalk, there is a sound along with a change to the IC display (effectively the opposite of what happened when you turned it on.)
      Last edited by BertL; 11-12-2019 at 06:19 PM.
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    19. #17
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      When Volvo PA loses track of lane marks, it makes vibration of steering wheel, and gray out the icon on driver display and HUD.

      Some people think this not enough and need an audible alarm, which seems to be useful but not needed and would create a driver habit relying on audible alarm and causing slower response. If people do feel need of audible alarm, usually means they didn't pay enough attention on road or steering wheel.

      To use PA defensively, you need to observe and realize the lane mark is gone if on such road before PA could disengage.
      Last edited by FusionRedXC60; 11-12-2019 at 07:15 PM.
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    20. #18
      Junior Member RootDKJ's Avatar
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      Kinda off-topic here but...

      So against sane logic, I tested the water bottle hack while using PA. It was very early in the morning and there were very few other cars on my highway.

      I must say, I was quite impressed. I even found myself "sub-consciously" holding or touching the steering wheel when I didn't "need" to. "Fatigue" was even more reduced. For everyday driving, I wouldn't do it, but for long stretches of empty open road, I'd probably do that again.
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    21. #19
      Junior Member BertL's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by RootDKJ View Post
      Kinda off-topic here but...

      So against sane logic, I tested the water bottle hack while using PA. It was very early in the morning and there were very few other cars on my highway.

      I must say, I was quite impressed. I even found myself "sub-consciously" holding or touching the steering wheel when I didn't "need" to. "Fatigue" was even more reduced. For everyday driving, I wouldn't do it, but for long stretches of empty open road, I'd probably do that again.
      Suggestion: Just keep your awareness antenna up, not only for yourself, but other drivers around you. The tech can lead one into a false sense of security. It’s only emerging software with more variables to consider than our puny brains recognize and react to without conscious thought.

      The exceptions are what will get any of us in trouble if we’re not careful. E.g. I know it’s not Volvo Pilot Assist, but as much as I liked and also used AutoPilot for long distance traveling and in stop/go freeway traffic for years (and will likely enjoy PA for similar reasons) — with always at least one hand firmly on the wheel, I also had AP go bizerk in the weirdest unexplainable situations. Some examples:
      • Twice (several months/year apart, so different software levels) in different dark highway stretches I’ve traveled thousands of miles on, in the middle of the desert at 70+mph with clear skies and no one else around, AP all of a sudden decided to I guess “follow” a big lone bush or tree outcropping on the side of the road, making a quick right I had to correct or would have been out beyond the ditch with the cactus and reptiles. Let me tell you, my heart was beating and I was sweating after both times.
      • Another time AP decided out of the blue to hang a right towards a semi when we’d been traveling pretty much side-by-side in our clearly marked lanes for miles at 60mph+. I would have hit the semi underneath the trailer and between its wheels if I had not intervened. I couldn’t recreate what we called “truck lust”, even when I tried to the next day with same software levels, at roughly the same time of day, in the same location (I know, crazy me — but both hands were on the wheel, both times!)
      • There are multi-mile stretches of a 55mph road (non-freeway) I travel at least weekly where AP worked fairly well around me — but sometimes AP wouldn’t identify the left median curbs along one part of that road, in the mornings, in only one direction. When AP couldn’t find the curb, all of a sudden it began to quickly re-center itself towards the curb (in what I suspect it perceived was now a wider lane), requiring my intervention to take it out of AP control for fear of getting road rash on my wheels. Afternoons, evenings, and overcast mornings, no issue — just some unexplainable mornings a problem, others not. After months trying to ID the exception so I could report a more precise scenario to Tesla for possible resolution, it stopped being a fun experiment and I no longer used AP on anything but highways.

      To this day, I think there is something about shadows, reflections, etc both day and night that add a whole other level of complexity to the visual identification software that must be independently designed and refined by each mfgr. They all have a long way to go making these early driver assist tools into autonomous systems that can be trusted with our lives. Anyway, the moral is, if I had not had my hands lightly on the wheel and mind at the ready, things could have been bad within a split second before both hands got back to the wheel. Take care out there!
      Last edited by BertL; 11-13-2019 at 11:23 AM.
      Bert

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    22. #20
      Junior Member PSamy's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by BertL View Post
      Suggestion: Just keep your awareness antenna up, not only for yourself, but other drivers around you. The tech can lead one into a false sense of security. It’s only emerging software with more variables to consider than our puny brains recognize and react to without conscious thought.

      The exceptions are what will get any of us in trouble if we’re not careful. E.g. I know it’s not Volvo Pilot Assist, but as much as I liked and also used AutoPilot for long distance traveling and in stop/go freeway traffic for years (and will likely enjoy PA for similar reasons) — with always at least one hand firmly on the wheel, I also had AP go bizerk in the weirdest unexplainable situations. Some examples:
      • Twice (several months/year apart, so different software levels) in different dark highway stretches I’ve traveled thousands of miles on, in the middle of the desert at 70+mph with clear skies and no one else around, AP all of a sudden decided to I guess “follow” a big lone bush or tree outcropping on the side of the road, making a quick right I had to correct or would have been out beyond the ditch with the cactus and reptiles. Let me tell you, my heart was beating and I was sweating after both times.
      • Another time AP decided out of the blue to hang a right towards a semi when we’d been traveling pretty much side-by-side in our clearly marked lanes for miles at 60mph+. I would have hit the semi underneath the trailer and between its wheels if I had not intervened. I couldn’t recreate what we called “truck lust”, even when I tried to the next day with same software levels, at roughly the same time of day, in the same location (I know, crazy me — but both hands were on the wheel, both times!)
      • There are multi-mile stretches of a 55mph road (non-freeway) I travel at least weekly where AP worked fairly well around me — but sometimes AP wouldn’t identify the left median curbs along one part of that road, in the mornings, in only one direction. When AP couldn’t find the curb, all of a sudden it began to quickly re-center itself towards the curb (in what I suspect it perceived was now a wider lane), requiring my intervention to take it out of AP control for fear of getting road rash on my wheels. Afternoons, evenings, and overcast mornings, no issue — just some unexplainable mornings a problem, others not. After months trying to ID the exception so I could report a more precise scenario to Tesla for possible resolution, it stopped being a fun experiment and I no longer used AP on anything but highways.

      To this day, I think there is something about shadows, reflections, etc both day and night that add a whole other level of complexity to the visual identification software that must be independently designed and refined by each mfgr. They all have a long way to go making these early driver assist tools into autonomous systems that can be trusted with our lives. Anyway, the moral is, if I had not had my hands lightly on the wheel and mind at the ready, things could have been bad within a split second before both hands got back to the wheel. Take care out there!
      I second that!
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