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    1. #71
      Junior Member SteveP's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by gak View Post
      Interest only mortgages? They are crazy. I've always put down 10-20%.

      Things sound like they have changed a lot in Sweden. I lived in Stockholm in the 1970s, in ńppelviken, Bromma, from where I took the trykk to work and was at the Central Station in about 15 minutes. We rented a small villa (detached house) with a yard that would sell for about $3-400K at that time, what a house more than twice the size would cost in the Washington suburbs with a comparable commute. In NYC at that time $3-400K might get you a comparable house, but the commute would be well over an hour by train.

      Also, my neighbors said that banks typically required a 30% or higher down payment when applying for a mortgage.

      When I lived in Norway in the mid-1980s houses were even more expensive compared to the United States, so were condos.
      We were in Gothenberg, Stockholm and Oslo in June last year. From just the tourist perspective it seemed Oslo was much more expensive. We had to detour off the highway through Jonkoping, which looked like it would be a nice place to retire.

      As for tires, I'm not wanting to leave the 19" P-Zeros on our new to us S90, but I don't want to fork out a fortune for winter wheels. Considering Vredestein Wintrac Xtreme S. They're well rated here and Tire Rack.
      His: 2018 S90 Momentum Osium Gray/Black Hers: 2015.5 V60 Premiere E-Drive Silver/Black
      Gone But Not Forgotten: 2006 XC90 V8 Silver/Black, 2010 C30 T5 R Design Passion Red, 2004 V70R Ti/Gobi, 2004 S80, 2001 V70, 740GLE and too many 240s to count!
      To R is Still Human!

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    3. #72
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      Quote Originally Posted by mattlach View Post
      So, I'll answer my own question.

      Apparently our cars are equipped with a new type of TPMS system called iTMPS or Indirect TPMS (as opposed to the traditional dTPMS or Direct TPMS systems that require in-wheel sensors)

      Wikipedia describes it as follows:


      You learn something ever day!
      Indirect TPMS has been around for a while - my last car had it. My car previous to that had direct TPMS and as a result I will avoid a car with direct TPMS (unless theyíve improved the systems). Why? Because in the old direct TPMS systems you had to reprogram the car every time you changed wheels. The memory (at least in my car) could not handle more than 5 IDís (4 wheels and the spare) so you had to make a trip to the dealer when you changed to winters. And back then, sensors were harder to find and expensive. It just seemed like a blatant way for manufacturers to drive customers to the dealer. I mean, how hard would it be to allow the TPMS monitoring system to hold two sets of wheels or have a mode to read and detect new sensors? Nowadays you can buy compatible aftermarket sensors and TPMS ID readers and Laptop connectors to do your own programming but it is just too much hassle. Further, the batteries last only as long as the typical life of a tire so itís one more wear item to think about.

      More importantly, my own experience with Indirect TPMS was very positive. I got a few false warnings while city driving (just a handful) but that was usually after I pumped up a tire and forgot to re-set the system. I got one real city driving warning and it turned out to be a nail in the tire. I got one high speed highway warning and it gave me enough time to get to the right shoulder before the tire disintegrated. Itís a simpler and superior system to just use the existing ABS system to indirectly monitor tire inflation, IMO. Btw, my car didnít have a spare but thatís another topic...

    4. #73
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      Quote Originally Posted by CedarMtn View Post
      Indirect TPMS has been around for a while - my last car had it. My car previous to that had direct TPMS and as a result I will avoid a car with direct TPMS (unless theyíve improved the systems). Why? Because in the old direct TPMS systems you had to reprogram the car every time you changed wheels. The memory (at least in my car) could not handle more than 5 IDís (4 wheels and the spare) so you had to make a trip to the dealer when you changed to winters. And back then, sensors were harder to find and expensive. It just seemed like a blatant way for manufacturers to drive customers to the dealer. I mean, how hard would it be to allow the TPMS monitoring system to hold two sets of wheels or have a mode to read and detect new sensors? Nowadays you can buy compatible aftermarket sensors and TPMS ID readers and Laptop connectors to do your own programming but it is just too much hassle. Further, the batteries last only as long as the typical life of a tire so itís one more wear item to think about.

      More importantly, my own experience with Indirect TPMS was very positive. I got a few false warnings while city driving (just a handful) but that was usually after I pumped up a tire and forgot to re-set the system. I got one real city driving warning and it turned out to be a nail in the tire. I got one high speed highway warning and it gave me enough time to get to the right shoulder before the tire disintegrated. Itís a simpler and superior system to just use the existing ABS system to indirectly monitor tire inflation, IMO. Btw, my car didnít have a spare but thatís another topic...
      https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiret....jsp?techid=44

      To me personally, it just feels like they are being cheap and try to cost cut the TPMS sensors out. All the cheap cars have Indirect TPMS because it is cheaper to do (require no additional sensors and just few lines of code) to comply with the law.

      It has few shortcomings, for example, you will never know the exact pressure in each wheels, during season changes all the tire will inflate/deflate at the same rate which means the system will see all wheel speed the same and not alert if all wheels are over or under-inflated.

      Certain manufacturers restricting IDs to 5 is probably their attempt to get more money from you. The few cars I owned all are able to store 2 sets of TPMS. One car even has a fall back that if no sensors are detected, it will use Indirect TPMS to monitor the wheels.

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    6. #74
      Junior Member mattlach's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by rentalcar View Post
      Same as last year, winter setup: 20" Ixion IV with 255/35 Hakka R2.
      I've never heard of anyone using low profile winters before.

      Heck, I'm even antsy about using 20's during the summer

      The old rule of thumb is, and it IS accurate, that for the best winter (snow & ice tranction) you want the smallest compatible rim for your car, with the narrowest compatible tires.

      Since 18" rims are the smallest that fit over the brakes on my S90 that's what I had to use. I also went with a narrower than stock 225/50R18's for the best possible winter performance.

      The Continental ContiVikingContact 7's have been fantastic in this configuration.

    7. #75
      Junior Member mattlach's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by CedarMtn View Post
      Indirect TPMS has been around for a while - my last car had it. My car previous to that had direct TPMS and as a result I will avoid a car with direct TPMS (unless theyíve improved the systems). Why? Because in the old direct TPMS systems you had to reprogram the car every time you changed wheels. The memory (at least in my car) could not handle more than 5 IDís (4 wheels and the spare) so you had to make a trip to the dealer when you changed to winters. And back then, sensors were harder to find and expensive. It just seemed like a blatant way for manufacturers to drive customers to the dealer. I mean, how hard would it be to allow the TPMS monitoring system to hold two sets of wheels or have a mode to read and detect new sensors? Nowadays you can buy compatible aftermarket sensors and TPMS ID readers and Laptop connectors to do your own programming but it is just too much hassle. Further, the batteries last only as long as the typical life of a tire so itís one more wear item to think about.

      More importantly, my own experience with Indirect TPMS was very positive. I got a few false warnings while city driving (just a handful) but that was usually after I pumped up a tire and forgot to re-set the system. I got one real city driving warning and it turned out to be a nail in the tire. I got one high speed highway warning and it gave me enough time to get to the right shoulder before the tire disintegrated. Itís a simpler and superior system to just use the existing ABS system to indirectly monitor tire inflation, IMO. Btw, my car didnít have a spare but thatís another topic...

      That was not the experience I had on any of my cars with direct TPMS.

      2001 Saab 9-5 Aero
      2004 Saab 9-5 Aero
      2011 Saab 9-5 Turbo4
      2009 Volvo S80

      Whenever I swapped the wheels every winter/summer changeover they just auto-detected the sensors in the new wheels and continued working. No special tools or dealership visits needed.

      What car did you have this issue on?

      My biggest gripe with the direct TPMS was that the sensors were expensive when I needed to buy them for my second set of wheels.

    8. #76
      Junior Member pocholin's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by hourglass View Post
      https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tiret....jsp?techid=44

      To me personally, it just feels like they are being cheap and try to cost cut the TPMS sensors out. All the cheap cars have Indirect TPMS because it is cheaper to do (require no additional sensors and just few lines of code) to comply with the law.

      It has few shortcomings, for example, you will never know the exact pressure in each wheels, during season changes all the tire will inflate/deflate at the same rate which means the system will see all wheel speed the same and not alert if all wheels are over or under-inflated.

      Certain manufacturers restricting IDs to 5 is probably their attempt to get more money from you. The few cars I owned all are able to store 2 sets of TPMS. One car even has a fall back that if no sensors are detected, it will use Indirect TPMS to monitor the wheels.
      One of Volvo's success is cutting costs. They're launching vehicles with lots of technology but it isn't necessarily the latest and greatest, nor the most refined but it gets the job done. Downsizing to three engine configurations in the US has been great to standardize parts and training for their technicians.

      Sent from my XZ2 Compact using Tapatalk
      2017 V90 CC T6- Luxury pkg with full color paint Maple Brown with blond interior, convenience pkg, B&W, HUD, four-C. Racechip GTS.

    9. #77
      Junior Member mattlach's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by pocholin View Post
      One of Volvo's success is cutting costs. They're launching vehicles with lots of technology but it isn't necessarily the latest and greatest, nor the most refined but it gets the job done. Downsizing to three engine configurations in the US has been great to standardize parts and training for their technicians.
      Yeah, to survive in any business you have to watch the bottom line.

      This is especially true with in automotive industry with its razor thin margins.

    10. #78
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      Quote Originally Posted by mattlach View Post
      That was not the experience I had on any of my cars with direct TPMS.

      2001 Saab 9-5 Aero
      2004 Saab 9-5 Aero
      2011 Saab 9-5 Turbo4
      2009 Volvo S80

      Whenever I swapped the wheels every winter/summer changeover they just auto-detected the sensors in the new wheels and continued working. No special tools or dealership visits needed.

      What car did you have this issue on?

      My biggest gripe with the direct TPMS was that the sensors were expensive when I needed to buy them for my second set of wheels.
      2nd gen Highlander Hybrid. The sensors were about $175 per wheel at the time too. I bit the bullet and bought a set for my winter wheels before I found out that there was no way for the system to register 9 idís. Many people would just put a piece of black tape to hide the TPMS warning light vs buying the sensors. I didnít own it very long though - it was great for hauling the kids around the city but terrible as an ďSUVĒ - towing and doing light off road stuff.

      Strictly my opinion: Indirect TPMS is superior and the fact that it is less expensive is a side benefit. An indirect system uses components that are already on a car. Itís simpler and it works. Within the thresholds that trigger a direct TPMS warning, there is minimal difference between when an indirect system would detect a change in speed for an individual wheel and trigger a warning. The main negatives are when the car is not moving. Eg: No direct read of tire pressures (which some direct systems provide). And you need to remember to reset the system after you change, rotate, or inflate tires. I always keep my tires in good shape and check pressures fairly regularly (have a 20V Dewalt inflator in my garage). And again, my experience with a high speed indirect TPMS warning was favourable. It warned me before any noticeable vibration was felt, allowing me to move over two lanes to the shoulder before the tire failed.

    11. #79
      Junior Member mattlach's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by CedarMtn View Post
      Quote Originally Posted by mattlach View Post
      That was not the experience I had on any of my cars with direct TPMS.

      2001 Saab 9-5 Aero
      2004 Saab 9-5 Aero
      2011 Saab 9-5 Turbo4
      2009 Volvo S80

      Whenever I swapped the wheels every winter/summer changeover they just auto-detected the sensors in the new wheels and continued working. No special tools or dealership visits needed.

      What car did you have this issue on?

      My biggest gripe with the direct TPMS was that the sensors were expensive when I needed to buy them for my second set of wheels.
      2nd gen Highlander Hybrid. The sensors were about $175 per wheel at the time too. I bit the bullet and bought a set for my winter wheels before I found out that there was no way for the system to register 9 id’s. Many people would just put a piece of black tape to hide the TPMS warning light vs buying the sensors. I didn’t own it very long though - it was great for hauling the kids around the city but terrible as an “SUV” - towing and doing light off road stuff.

      Strictly my opinion: Indirect TPMS is superior and the fact that it is less expensive is a side benefit. An indirect system uses components that are already on a car. It’s simpler and it works. Within the thresholds that trigger a direct TPMS warning, there is minimal difference between when an indirect system would detect a change in speed for an individual wheel and trigger a warning. The main negatives are when the car is not moving. Eg: No direct read of tire pressures (which some direct systems provide). And you need to remember to reset the system after you change, rotate, or inflate tires. I always keep my tires in good shape and check pressures fairly regularly (have a 20V Dewalt inflator in my garage). And again, my experience with a high speed indirect TPMS warning was favourable. It warned me before any noticeable vibration was felt, allowing me to move over two lanes to the shoulder before the tire failed.
      I haven't made up my mind yet on this topic.

      I like that it is cheaper, but I guess I haven't built up my comfort level regarding trusting the system yet.

      For instance, when I put my summers on my 20"'s I inflated them to my desired pressure and pressed the training button in the car status menu.

      I'm not sure if it did it's thing. The button has been greyed out ever since, so if I wanted to re-train it now, I couldn't. And that was back in April.

      It is unclear to me how it works. Is it greyed out due to a bug, or does it only allow you to retrain the system if it senses a change?

      I have to say, I liked how my 2011 Saab 9-5 gave me the actual psi reading for each wheel in the dash, and I have kind of missed that ever since. My previous daily driver, my S80 T6 had sensors in the wheels, but it would only flash a tire pressure warming light if one of them was low. It wouldn't tell me the actual pressure or which tire was low.

      In the grand scheme of things - however - I spent most of my time as a driver without any TPMS at all, and that never caused me a problem, so I am not that concerned.

      I am a little bit of a data geek though. My philosophy had always been to have as much information as possible, and I've always loved cockpit-style driving designs that present you with all that information in an as ergonomic fashion as possible. I hate modern minimalist designs like the Tesla Model 3 that hide everything from you. The Apple approach of oversimplifying everything and hiding the details is one I have great disdain for.

      After all, the devil's in the details.

    12. #80
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      Quote Originally Posted by mattlach View Post
      I haven't made up my mind yet on this topic.

      I like that it is cheaper, but I guess I haven't built up my comfort level regarding trusting the system yet.

      For instance, when I put my summers on my 20"'s I inflated them to my desired pressure and pressed the training button in the car status menu.

      I'm not sure if it did it's thing. The button has been greyed out ever since, so if I wanted to re-train it now, I couldn't. And that was back in April.

      It is unclear to me how it works. Is it greyed out due to a bug, or does it only allow you to retrain the system if it senses a change?

      I have to say, I liked how my 2011 Saab 9-5 gave me the actual psi reading for each wheel in the dash, and I have kind of missed that ever since. My previous daily driver, my S80 T6 had sensors in the wheels, but it would only flash a tire pressure warming light if one of them was low. It wouldn't tell me the actual pressure or which tire was low.

      In the grand scheme of things - however - I spent most of my time as a driver without any TPMS at all, and that never caused me a problem, so I am not that concerned.

      I am a little bit of a data geek though. My philosophy had always been to have as much information as possible, and I've always loved cockpit-style driving designs that present you with all that information in an as ergonomic fashion as possible. I hate modern minimalist designs like the Tesla Model 3 that hide everything from you. The Apple approach of oversimplifying everything and hiding the details is one I have great disdain for.

      After all, the devil's in the details.
      Like you, I've spent more time in cars without TPMS - so it's a nice to have, not a need to have. In 40 plus years of driving, I've only had a handful of flats and only two on the highway at high speeds (one being with the indirect TPMS system). Honestly, when I got the dash warning, my first instinct was it must be a glitch as I didn't feel any lurch or vibration. But about a second later, I felt a little drag - so quickly moved over to the shoulder before the tire disintegrated. So the system worked well.

    13. #81
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      I prefer the direct pressure readout system. If it's 20F (as it is here pretty much from Dec through March) I'd prefer not having to walk around the car with a pressure gage, wearing lined gloves and fumbling with the stem cover, to see if I should top off the tires. The pressure system on my past cars have been very reliable and matched the readings on my hand-held. Both systems are probably equally good at signally a tire event.

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