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    1. #1
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      Vehicle Deaths per Year

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_...n_U.S._by_year

      It is a risky activity. The 70s were the worst of times. It's getting safer, but still. Buckle up guys.

      Deaths by gender :

      https://www.iihs.org/topics/fatality.../detail/gender
      Last edited by Highwayman; 11-23-2019 at 06:24 AM.
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    3. #2
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      Male deaths by motorcycle and bicycle certainly isn’t a surprise...motorcyclists clueless about the speed and power of their rides, risk-taking and paying the ultimate price. And with the spectacular growth of food delivery, usually by bike on crowded urban roads, more carnage for young males.

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      Quote Originally Posted by john_hamster View Post
      Male deaths by motorcycle and bicycle certainly isn’t a surprise...motorcyclists clueless about the speed and power of their rides, risk-taking and paying the ultimate price. And with the spectacular growth of food delivery, usually by bike on crowded urban roads, more carnage for young males.
      31% of fatal motorcycle accidents involved motorcyclists who did not have a valid motorcycle operator's license. And when you look at motorcycle fatalities by age, the over-50 group dies more often than the under-30 group. Putting that together we see that the biggest issues for motorcyclists are people failing to get a motorcycle license and old people who are returning to motorcycling after years of not riding. As you said, people who simply don't have riding skills. But it's not really a young male problem.
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    6. #4
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      Quote Originally Posted by zenmervolt View Post
      31% of fatal motorcycle accidents involved motorcyclists who did not have a valid motorcycle operator's license. And when you look at motorcycle fatalities by age, the over-50 group dies more often than the under-30 group. Putting that together we see that the biggest issues for motorcyclists are people failing to get a motorcycle license and old people who are returning to motorcycling after years of not riding. As you said, people who simply don't have riding skills. But it's not really a young male problem.
      the iihs data also shows the number of pedestrian deaths. Once at a crosswalk an elderly man walking his little dog nearly got under my S60 had it not been for City Safety. But what's disturbing is there is an uptick in pedestrian casualties in 2016 and 2017 most likely due to texting and driving. Or just that people are in a BIG HURRY theses days and the strikes are at high speed.

      Let's just take a step back and get at the root of the problem. Why do people rush ? because they hit the snooze bar too many times, they stayed up too late the night before, had a hot date, etc.

      I think a big problem that exists with today's culture in America is there is a big sense of impatience. It's very disturbing. Why not get up a little early like Marcus Aurelius would say.

      But, yes motorcycle deaths have been on the rise.

      When I first looked at the data of the 70s what came to mind were the big 70s all steel heavy cars which did not have the engineering as far as bumper height/safety design to allow a pedestrian who is hit by the bumper to then strike the windshield rather than go underneath the car. This I'm sure saves lives.
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      in addition, i think the populace and people in general have developed an "entitlement " attitude. This includes pedestrians who are not only walking and texting, they feel they can step out into the street anytime they want. I've seen bicyclists texting, moms pushing their baby carriages with their heads buried in their phones.

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      Although I live in a suburb, I work in a city. I have seen close calls by what was just described. People walking and texting. Around my way most people drive to get milk. But in the city a lot of the pedestrians are not paying attention because they do at times feel they have the right of way. But when they are texting or reading while walking it is very irritating as a driver trying to avoid them. Yes, bicycle deaths on the rise because of Uber Eats, Relay, Grub Hub, Caviat, Amazon Prime etc because people in the city are too lazy to go out and walk to a supermarket, meet people, gather ingredients and cook a meal. They are in a hurry, want their food and don't care how it gets there.

      Making these delivery persons deliver their groceries and meals is the way of the future. Not only food but pet supplies and heavier things like water. Whether we like it or not..it is easier. It costs money to get into the car, more difficult to drive in the rain or snow and deal with parking and or traffic. But it is a joy to see a person walking respectfully with 2 or 4 shopping bags at a slow and steady pace while observing his surroundings and maybe even smiling or saying hello to a couple of people. But that does take more time.

      A way I have found to avoid the rush and frenzied feeling in stores and parking lots is to simply shop at off peak times. But walking is something I am guilty of not doing enough of..working on it.
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    9. #7
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      I'm with you guys on people walking and texting and crossing the streets with their heads burried in the phone. Sure they have the right of way but they are ultimately responsible for their safety.
      If a car hits you your right of way will not heal you.


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      I get into heated discussions on other forums about this..( not here), in that no one has the right to step into oncoming traffic, right-of-way or not....it's a joint responsibility...

    11. #9
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      Vehicle Deaths per Yea

      Why give motor vehicle drivers a pass when it comes to pedestrian fatalities?

      Drivers must maintain control of their motorized conveyance of choice.

      Personally have a zero tolerance for motor vehicle encroachment into marked cross-walks or at intersections where pedestrians attempt to cross.

      I can cite innumerable incidents when motorized vehicles piloted by homicidal drivers at high speeds through cross walk areas that have traversed within feet of women, children or anyone else totally unable to protect themselves from hazardous inattentive drivers.

      Spent many years driving as a civil servant in high density urban traffic situations in the City of Angels, and personally witnessed this un-natural total disregard for pedestrian safety that is in-excusable, while being completely preventable.

      I am firmly on the 100% driver responsibility on this subject, and can make the claim to have never injured a pedestrian in 40 years of urban driving.

      Just my own flawed opinion, surely there will be dissent to this point of view.

    12. #10
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      Quote Originally Posted by jlh3rd View Post
      I get into heated discussions on other forums about this..( not here), in that no one has the right to step into oncoming traffic, right-of-way or not....it's a joint responsibility...
      The very worst are dull tools walking between cars in supermarket parking lots with their heads buried in their iPhones, and suddenly they are 2-3ft. in front of your front bumper...hit your brakes, then get a dirty look...priceless!

    13. #11
      Quote Originally Posted by Highwayman View Post
      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_...n_U.S._by_year

      It is a risky activity. The 70s were the worst of times. It's getting safer, but still. Buckle up guys.

      Deaths by gender :

      https://www.iihs.org/topics/fatality.../detail/gender
      One thing you're overlooking is that beginning in the 1950s and moving into the 1960s, the Federal Highway System was created. Meaning traffic moved at a more rapid pace, increasing the chance of fatalities. And it's not like cars back in the 60s had seat belts or airbags.

      Of course, once seat belts and other safety measures were instituted, deaths began to decrease substantially.

    14. #12
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      the quality and safety of current cars knows no bounds. Traffic accidents and deaths should have dropped dramatically from 60's and 70's levels, but they haven't. The one thing that has not improved, but actually gotten a lot worse are the drivers.
      Anyone can push a gas pedal down, that ,in no way, means they are capable of handling the car.
      Entitled drivers think the rules are not for them, crosswalks and everything else.....

    15. #13
      Quote Originally Posted by jlh3rd View Post
      the quality and safety of current cars knows no bounds. Traffic accidents and deaths should have dropped dramatically from 60's and 70's levels, but they haven't. The one thing that has not improved, but actually gotten a lot worse are the drivers.
      Anyone can push a gas pedal down, that ,in no way, means they are capable of handling the car.
      Entitled drivers think the rules are not for them, crosswalks and everything else.....
      You're clearly not looking at the table. Deaths in the 60s and 70s were in the range of mid 40 to low 50s (thousands). The death toll is now in the upper 30s. And this is with an increased population.

      1979 had a population of 225 Million people and an accident death toll of 51,000
      2017 has a population of 326 Million people and an accident death toll of 37,000

      So more people both in the United States and on the road has netted a drop of 14,000 lives. If the 1979 bell curve were to hold true, you'd expect close to 60,000 deaths with another 100 million people (about 1/3rd more). Assuming not all of those 1/3rd are drivers. Yet instead, we see a decrease from better safety systems (Front & Side airbags, ABS brakes, seat belts, better design, etc).

    16. #14
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      you're counting just deaths......i'm counting accidents and deaths....unfortunately, there doesn't seem to be an accurate number of all accident comparisons through the years. The carnage on the road has increased, there may not be as many dying because of the safety features in the cars but i can tell you that every day in harrisburg, pa. there's always accidents. Not even close to what i remember decades ago.

    17. #15
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      Quote Originally Posted by Repsolgamma View Post
      Why give motor vehicle drivers a pass when it comes to pedestrian fatalities?
      Because when someone steps into a mid-block crosswalk with a car going the speed limit only 5 feet away, that one's on the pedestrian; not even perfect drivers can alter the laws of physics.

      Here in Washington, while drivers are required (as they should be) to yield to pedestrians who are in crosswalks, pedestrians are also forbidden (as they should be) to enter crosswalks if doing so would require an approaching vehicle to take emergency evasive action.

      Sometimes it legitimately is the pedestrian's fault.
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    18. #16
      Quote Originally Posted by jlh3rd View Post
      you're counting just deaths......i'm counting accidents and deaths....unfortunately, there doesn't seem to be an accurate number of all accident comparisons through the years. The carnage on the road has increased, there may not be as many dying because of the safety features in the cars but i can tell you that every day in harrisburg, pa. there's always accidents. Not even close to what i remember decades ago.
      Anecdotal tales of accidents don't mean a trend. Again, by simply looking at accident deaths through the years, cars have become much safe. Because accidents deaths have fallen to around ~37,000 from a height of 50,000+. Meaning that even as America's population increases (225 million (1979) ---> 326 Million (2017) few people are losing their lives in crashes.

      So while accidents are likely happening at an increased rate, because there are more people on the road than in 1979, these accidents don't end in a fatality. +1 for Seatbelts, Airbags, Reinforced steel Frames, etc.

    19. #17
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      i think we are saying the same thing...

    20. #18
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      Quote Originally Posted by zenmervolt View Post
      31% of fatal motorcycle accidents involved motorcyclists who did not have a valid motorcycle operator's license. And when you look at motorcycle fatalities by age, the over-50 group dies more often than the under-30 group. Putting that together we see that the biggest issues for motorcyclists are people failing to get a motorcycle license and old people who are returning to motorcycling after years of not riding. As you said, people who simply don't have riding skills. But it's not really a young male problem.
      I hung up my motorcycle gear about 3 years ago when I realized my skills had started to deteriorate. I guess 53+ years on two wheels was enough, but still miss it. I believe the comments about older “returning” riders is spot on, I’ve talked with quite a few of them, and watched them on the road. I note some who won’t use the front brake, I guess because it will throw them down (lol). And the ones who paddle with both feet near the ground while departing a stop. A friend teaches Motorcycle Safety Courses, and he sees very, very few older riders sign up for training.

      One factor in my departure from that great hobby is my growing distrust of car drivers. I got knocked off my Ducati back in ‘97 by a driver using her cell phone while driving in heavy traffic. She made a quick move into the HOV lane, sans turn signals or any indication. She “never saw me”. There are laws against cell phone use in this state, but every single time I drive somewhere, I see a driver using a cell phone. People “drive” like they’re playing a video game. I don’t call it “distracted” driving, I call it “NOT” driving.

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      Quote Originally Posted by MyVolvoS60 View Post
      One thing you're overlooking is that beginning in the 1950s and moving into the 1960s, the Federal Highway System was created. Meaning traffic moved at a more rapid pace, increasing the chance of fatalities. And it's not like cars back in the 60s had seat belts or airbags.

      Of course, once seat belts and other safety measures were instituted, deaths began to decrease substantially.
      While vehicles are safer one feature I think cars could do without is Apple CarPlay

      That's a bad safety idea.

      https://money.cnn.com/2014/03/05/tec...lay/index.html

      While I understand the apps on the phone integrated with the car's features are voice recognition software based, the article's main point is "Cognitive Distraction"

      Mind not on the road.
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    22. #20
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      this is one reason why , i feel, that cars are moving to self driving cars. More and more youngers could care less about the driving experience and just wanna hang on their phones....Self driving cars would, supposedly, drastically reduce auto accident mortality rates.....so they say...

    23. #21
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      I’m interested in car-to-car communications as a safety method. I know Volvo has this in Europe. It would be great if the would turn that on in the US.
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    24. #22
      Quote Originally Posted by Highwayman View Post
      While vehicles are safer one feature I think cars could do without is Apple CarPlay

      That's a bad safety idea.

      https://money.cnn.com/2014/03/05/tec...lay/index.html

      While I understand the apps on the phone integrated with the car's features are voice recognition software based, the article's main point is "Cognitive Distraction"

      Mind not on the road.
      The More connected A Cars = The Great the Distractions.... There's a reason why 16-24 year olds have a high risk of accidents. New Driver, Easily Distracted, etc. And why this same subset doesn't see a reduction until age 25. Or why rental car companies will often not rent a vehicle to anyone under age 25.

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      Vehicle-to-vehicle Communication would be great.

      https://www.nhtsa.gov/technology-inn...-communication

      This is where the future of driving is headed. Autonomous driving may be 10, 15 or 20 years away. Will we ever let go of the steering column ? Can we actually drink our coffee and read our paper while our car drives us ?

      I had 3 accidents (fender benders) as a kid from late teens to early twenties. Learned my lessons, drive much slower these days. My last 2 accidents were 11 years ago and about 9 years ago, both non-fault open and shut cases with police reports as I was not at fault. My Passat accident in 2008 was a scary one as the car was totalled by a 5 series BMW doing about 100. The last one in my 1999 coffee colored Camry with tan cloth couch seats got struck at a toll booth by a jackass Dodge Durango at a toll booth.

      I'm seeing less and less people who live in cities drive much less rent cars. We may move out of the sticks of NJ so our kids won't need cars. A necessity if you live in the sticks.
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      The more we automate tasks from driving to vacum cleaning the lazier or brain becomes.
      This technology that does things for us so we can concentrate on whatever else is not making us any smarter but, IMHO, is dulling our brains and senses.
      I see driving as a mental exercise where I use all my senses. The more interactive, like manual transmission, the better.
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    27. #25
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      8638 deaths by all causes per million. A little over 1% from car accidents... I'd worry more about heart disease and cancer. ...and drive a Volvo. 😉
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    28. #26
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      Quote Originally Posted by dbphillips View Post
      8638 deaths by all causes per million. A little over 1% from car accidents... I'd worry more about heart disease and cancer. ...and drive a Volvo. 😉
      I have heart disease and cancer...and drive a Volvo.

    29. #27
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      Quote Originally Posted by SeabeckS View Post
      I have heart disease and cancer...and drive a Volvo.
      At least you don't have diabetes
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    30. #28
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      Quote Originally Posted by Almaz View Post
      At least you don't have diabetes
      Not yet!

    31. #29
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      The thing about autonomous driving that sounds great is to activate it only when stuck in traffic. All other times I would disable it. And I agree about our health being more important. Life is not fair. Some people smoke and drink alcohol and live to 100 while some eat organic, exercise and pray and have bad luck. Take care, have hope and stay strong.
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    32. #30
      Quote Originally Posted by Highwayman View Post
      The thing about autonomous driving that sounds great is to activate it only when stuck in traffic. All other times I would disable it. And I agree about our health being more important. Life is not fair. Some people smoke and drink alcohol and live to 100 while some eat organic, exercise and pray and have bad luck. Take care, have hope and stay strong.
      Neighbor of mine died at 102. Smoked 50 years. Drove til his mid 90s. Ate bacon daily. Healthy as a horse til the end. Thing that took him out was a fall. Yes, he was still living on his own, gardening, and getting around at 102!

      If genetics tell me anything, I'm sure I'll drop dead long before 102 of a heart attack.

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