S60 Polestar Is Slower than Audi S4 Diesel
Username
Do you already have an account?
Forgot your password?
  • Log in or Sign up

    Results 1 to 28 of 28
    1. #1
      Member
      Join Date
      Aug 2009
      Location
      Toronto, Canada
      Posts
      2,076

      Angry S60 Polestar Is Slower than Audi S4 Diesel

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_R92Obvbfc&t=16s

      This is rather embarrassing.... It sounds worse than a diesel too! It seems Volvo just took the power numbers from the electric motor and added it up to the gas engine. Volvo desperately needs a 5 and 6 cylinder engine if it wants to be taken seriously. Journalists are always pointing out how the 4 cylinder engine with the Aisin 8 speed auto just doesn't cut it for a premium car like Volvo.

    2. Remove Advertisements

      Advertisements
       

    3. #2
      Member Avboden's Avatar
      Join Date
      Apr 2010
      Location
      Michigan
      Posts
      2,259
      There is quite literally already a thread about this RIGHT ABOVE THIS ONE man
      2019 S60 T6 Inscription
      1998 V70R. RIP Transmission
      1973 Volvo 1800ES which will someday get a T6 engine

    4. #3
      Senior Member Wayne T5's Avatar
      Join Date
      Nov 2002
      Location
      Russell Twp, OH
      Posts
      11,708
      Wait for it - three or four more links to this test being posted shortly.
      Past: '94 854, '99 S70 T5 SE, '99 S70 GLT, '04 S60R M, '12 S60 T5, '13 S60 T5, '15 S60 RD, '05 V70R GT
      Present: '95 854 T-5R, '06 XC70, '15 XC70 T6, '15.5 XC60 T6, '16 V60 P*

    5. Remove Advertisements
      SwedeSpeed.com
      Advertisements

    6. #4
      Junior Member Kamil's Avatar
      Join Date
      Nov 2019
      Posts
      804
      Exactly why I got the V60 CC vs Polestar wagon. Also with the Polestar you only get all wheel drive when you get battery charge.

      Itís a great looking car but definitely not worth anything compared to others.

      Only use case for it is if you only drive max 5 miles one way a day and want to look fast vs be fast.
      2020 V60 CC

    7. #5
      Junior Member
      Join Date
      Feb 2013
      Location
      Slovenia. EU
      Posts
      326
      Actualy I am surprised how Volvo did well compare to ICE 3.0 6 cylinder. Remeber in real life 2.0 gasoline engine plus battery power is not on term of power even close to classic ICE 3.0 six banger. In real life S60 hybrid is heavy saloon with realistic power betwen 310-320hp (remember that battery power (hp) is not the same power as ICE power, after 100-120 mph Volvo T8 is not much faster than 2.0 diesel engine, because battery power is useless but extra 200kg is just not wellcome when we accelerate). Offical 400 hp S60 T8 is real 400 hp only form 0-60 mph, after that power is decreasing.
      Heico S60 upgrade to 360hp is much faster than S60 T8 polestar engineered and Audi S4, but stil canít much to E53 AMG and M340i.
      Last edited by JG2; 01-05-2020 at 12:51 PM.

    8. #6
      Junior Member
      Join Date
      Nov 2017
      Location
      New England
      Posts
      602
      Quote Originally Posted by Kamil View Post
      Exactly why I got the V60 CC vs Polestar wagon. Also with the Polestar you only get all wheel drive when you get battery charge.

      Itís a great looking car but definitely not worth anything compared to others.

      Only use case for it is if you only drive max 5 miles one way a day and want to look fast vs be fast.
      I totally agree: I would only get the ICE-only Cross Country wagon, to get much better AWD delivery -- and the T5 version seems better than T6 or T8 because the supercharger messes with the transmission, making for more jerky gear shifts. I hope that Volvo/Polestar will come out with a Cross Country BEV soon. But the PHEV version looks like a real waste of money; other automakers do PHEVs much better than Volvo does.

    9. #7
      Junior Member
      Join Date
      Nov 2017
      Location
      New England
      Posts
      602
      Quote Originally Posted by JG2 View Post
      Actualy I am surprised how Volvo did well compare to ICE 3.0 6 cylinder. Remeber in real life 2.0 gasoline engine plus battery power is not on term of power even close to classic ICE 3.0 six banger. In real life S60 hybrid is heavy saloon with realistic power betwen 310-320hp (remember that battery power (hp) is not the same power as ICE power, after 100-120 mph Volvo T8 is not much faster than 2.0 diesel engine, because battery power is useless but extra 200kg is just not wellcome when we accelerate). Offical 400 hp S60 T8 is real 400 hp only form 0-60 mph, after that power is decreasing.
      Heico S60 upgrade to 360hp is much faster than S60 T8 polestar engineered and Audi S4, but stil canít much to E53 AMG and M340i.
      Volvo is just so schizophrenic on performance. If they really want to do performance cars, screw Polestar tunes and just put a V6 back in (or an inline 5 or 6, or a naturally aspirated V8 like they had a decade ago in XC90 and S90). Or, short of that, just focus on BEVs for performance.

    10. #8
      Junior Member
      Join Date
      Dec 2019
      Location
      Alba
      Posts
      22
      Quote Originally Posted by Kamil View Post
      Exactly why I got the V60 CC vs Polestar wagon. Also with the Polestar you only get all wheel drive when you get battery charge.

      Itís a great looking car but definitely not worth anything compared to others.

      Only use case for it is if you only drive max 5 miles one way a day and want to look fast vs be fast.
      Where are you getting this info from? The PE will always provide AWD via the generator on the ICE, although granted you won't get the full ~330bhp on the front wheels if the battery is flat.

      Also a 10 mile round trip is hardly going to be a stretch for a fully charged T8 - I have to hope this is hyperbole rather than genuine belief, or you have some very EV unfriendly conditions.
      For example see https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FT1_DhjeZ54 at around 2mins in - Driving Electric got ~26miles of mixed driving with heating and heated seats.

      I suspect the T8 is no where near as an attractive option in the "colonies" than here in Brexitland and the rest of Europe - I suspect most people here don't do more than 20 or 30 miles round trip commuting and certainly here in Scotland almost all public chargers are free to use and home chargers are free to install. As for the PE - well it's just a better driving T8 rather than a performance car, as I said in the first thread covering this video.

      Ultimately the Volvo will cost me about ~£450 a year to commute for me in electric rather than about ~£1700 for my BMW X3 Diesel and less than that in the first year as the electricity is rebated by Volvo - also lower gov taxes but still a "relatively" fun car to drive. Unfortunately we don't seem to get the T6 over here.
      Last edited by amadan; 01-05-2020 at 03:07 PM.

    11. #9
      Member
      Join Date
      Dec 2017
      Location
      PNW
      Posts
      5,656
      Quote Originally Posted by Kamil View Post
      Exactly why I got the V60 CC vs Polestar wagon. Also with the Polestar you only get all wheel drive when you get battery charge.

      Itís a great looking car but definitely not worth anything compared to others.

      Only use case for it is if you only drive max 5 miles one way a day and want to look fast vs be fast.
      AWD on T8/Polestar is always available when needed. Some battery is reserved for it. And ICE will generate electricity if necessary.

      Switch to Power mode or Instant AWD mode then you always have it.

      Sent from my Z978 using Tapatalk
      Rolling, Fusion Red - 2018 XC60 - T8
      Running to retire, 2000 V70XC 236+k miles

    12. #10
      Junior Member Kamil's Avatar
      Join Date
      Nov 2019
      Posts
      804
      Quote Originally Posted by FusionRedXC60 View Post
      AWD on T8/Polestar is always available when needed. Some battery is reserved for it. And ICE will generate electricity if necessary.

      Switch to Power mode or Instant AWD mode then you always have it.

      Sent from my Z978 using Tapatalk
      I donít think thatís correct, power to the rear is only provided by electrical motors when the battery is depleted itís simply a very heavy 2 wheel drive. Take the car on a long drive that requires heavy use of all wheel drive and the tiny battery will be depleted.

      Iím not an expert however All documents I reviewed and called Volvo factory reps as I wanted to order one show that only the external power source and regen chargers the battery. No on board generator to charge the battery.

      Documents are limited on the system if you got special information documented stating other facts please post.
      Last edited by Kamil; 01-05-2020 at 03:31 PM.
      2020 V60 CC

    13. #11
      Junior Member
      Join Date
      Nov 2017
      Location
      New England
      Posts
      602
      Maybe Volvo will bring back 6-cylinder engines!

      https://www.yahoo.com/autos/daimler-...135200488.html

    14. #12
      Junior Member
      Join Date
      Mar 2018
      Location
      Connecticut
      Posts
      429
      A
      Quote Originally Posted by cometguy View Post
      Maybe Volvo will bring back 6-cylinder engines!

      https://www.yahoo.com/autos/daimler-...135200488.html
      I would really like to see something other than a 2.0L 4 in everything. I donít mind the T5 in our XC40 but when it comes time to buy something bigger to replace our Jeep Iíd rather not spend so much money on a buzzy 4. The Germans do 4 and 6 cylinder engines and that is more appealing.
      My brideís - 2019 XC40 (July 2019 OSD), Momentum Mine - 2013 VW GTI Drivers Edition and 1996 VW GTI VR6 (bought new and still love it) Ours - 2008 Jeep GC Limited with a Hemi.

    15. #13
      Junior Member Kamil's Avatar
      Join Date
      Nov 2019
      Posts
      804
      Quote Originally Posted by cometguy View Post
      Maybe Volvo will bring back 6-cylinder engines!

      https://www.yahoo.com/autos/daimler-...135200488.html
      Just my opinion but thatís totally unnecessary.

      Volvo is not a performance brand, zero need for more power then what the current platform delivers. Not every manufacturer needs a performance devision in petrol. Volvoís performance team is now independent electric car manufacturer and will work together with them on T8 powered models.

      Iím surprised by people even starting posts like this. You want a fast car thatís great but thatís not a Volvo.

      Plus donít they want to be full electric by 2025? Why waist money on development of new patrol engine?
      2020 V60 CC

    16. #14
      Junior Member Kamil's Avatar
      Join Date
      Nov 2019
      Posts
      804
      Quote Originally Posted by GTIGuy View Post
      A

      I would really like to see something other than a 2.0L 4 in everything. I donít mind the T5 in our XC40 but when it comes time to buy something bigger to replace our Jeep Iíd rather not spend so much money on a buzzy 4. The Germans do 4 and 6 cylinder engines and that is more appealing.

      They also do 8 and 10 but they got performance models. Stock allroad its 4T stock Q5 4T Not unit you hit A6 you got an option to go to a V6T and thatís because itís super heavy and no electric support
      2020 V60 CC

    17. #15
      Junior Member
      Join Date
      Dec 2019
      Location
      Alba
      Posts
      22
      Quote Originally Posted by Kamil View Post
      Quote Originally Posted by FusionRedXC60 View Post
      AWD on T8/Polestar is always available when needed. Some battery is reserved for it. And ICE will generate electricity if necessary.

      Switch to Power mode or Instant AWD mode then you always have it.

      Sent from my Z978 using Tapatalk
      I don’t think that’s correct, power to the rear is only provided by electrical motors when the battery is depleted it’s simply a very heavy 2 wheel drive. Take the car on a long drive that requires heavy use of all wheel drive and the tiny battery will be depleted.

      I’m not an expert however All documents I reviewed and called Volvo factory reps as I wanted to order one show that only the external power source and regen chargers the battery. No on board generator to charge the battery.

      Documents are limited on the system if you got special information documented stating other facts please post.
      Not true - there is a generator on board. There’s an option for charging the battery off the engine in sensus.

      As for proof it’s already been provided on the other tread about this vehicle by beers and catfiend.
      https://forums.swedespeed.com/#/topics/613253?page=5

      AWD and PE mode will always give awd irrespective of the battery state. What the battery state impacts is if your car is a roughly 300bhp car or a 400bhp car.

    18. #16
      Junior Member
      Join Date
      Nov 2017
      Location
      London, England
      Posts
      6
      Quote Originally Posted by geokilla View Post
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_R92Obvbfc&t=16s

      This is rather embarrassing.... It sounds worse than a diesel too! It seems Volvo just took the power numbers from the electric motor and added it up to the gas engine. Volvo desperately needs a 5 and 6 cylinder engine if it wants to be taken seriously. Journalists are always pointing out how the 4 cylinder engine with the Aisin 8 speed auto just doesn't cut it for a premium car like Volvo.
      I agree .... Volvo need to bring back the 3.0L T6 which is in my MY2011 S60 Polestar. Never going to happen though, unfortunately. I think I could even give the new S60 Polestar a run for its money .... at least I have launch control (not sure how many left though lol ... evidently only allowed 200 over life of vehicle).

    19. #17
      Junior Member Kamil's Avatar
      Join Date
      Nov 2019
      Posts
      804
      Quote Originally Posted by amadan View Post
      Not true - there is a generator on board. Thereís an option for charging the battery off the engine in sensus.

      As for proof itís already been provided on the other tread about this vehicle by beers and catfiend.
      https://forums.swedespeed.com/#/topics/613253?page=5

      AWD and PE mode will always give awd irrespective of the battery state. What the battery state impacts is if your car is a roughly 300bhp car or a 400bhp car.
      Link doesnít work, also not sure if you have documentation from Volvo attached in that link but would gladly review it. Thanks 🙏


      Update

      I stand corrected you are correct as to the ability to charge the battery when driving. I just wonder how efficient that is if you depleted the battery and need all wheel drive all the time. However regardless you are correct.


      Link with information for details.

      http://volvo.custhelp.com/app/answer...hile-traveling
      Last edited by Kamil; 01-06-2020 at 08:07 AM.
      2020 V60 CC

    20. #18
      Member
      Join Date
      Aug 2009
      Location
      Toronto, Canada
      Posts
      2,076
      Quote Originally Posted by Kamil View Post
      They also do 8 and 10 but they got performance models. Stock allroad its 4T stock Q5 4T Not unit you hit A6 you got an option to go to a V6T and thatís because itís super heavy and no electric support
      The new 6 cylinders by Mercedes-Benz and VAG all have a 48V mild hybrid system.

    21. #19
      Junior Member Kamil's Avatar
      Join Date
      Nov 2019
      Posts
      804
      Quote Originally Posted by geokilla View Post
      The new 6 cylinders by Mercedes-Benz and VAG all have a 48V mild hybrid system.
      Good information, Iím not to familiar with the MB new systems. I did not own one in 10 years.
      2020 V60 CC

    22. #20
      Junior Member
      Join Date
      Aug 2019
      Location
      Belgium
      Posts
      56
      Quote Originally Posted by FusionRedXC60 View Post
      AWD on T8/Polestar is always available when needed. Some battery is reserved for it. And ICE will generate electricity if necessary.

      Switch to Power mode or Instant AWD mode then you always have it.

      Sent from my Z978 using Tapatalk
      Volvo sales person told me the same when I bought the S60 twin engine 2020, so I assume that is correct indeed


      Sent from my smartphone using Tapatalk

    23. #21
      Member volvocu's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jul 2003
      Location
      ISTANBUL
      Posts
      1,967
      First lets review some facts:
      1- Volvo is a small manufacturer with relatively little resources, they have chosen to prioritize their investments based on highest return expectations
      2- They have committed to an electrified future, in 5 years they plan to have 50% of their sales made up of BEVs
      3- This path has been demonstrated to be successful AND sustainable

      Therefore do not expect to see anything larger than 4 cylinders.

      OTOH, Volvoís 4 cylinder engines are rough compared to the Germansí, hence Volvo has decided to collaborate with Geely to develop their next generation ICE. There is also talk now of a possible synergy with Mercedes. Additionally, the then-innovative model of cramming the battery within the ďtransmission tunnelĒ has now been surpassed by the Germans thanks to their larger batteries without compromising much on space. They need to improve the technical configuration on the SPA2 platform. Whatís more, their plug-in cars are much too heavy, which is the main reason the S60 posted the dismal performance at the drag strip.

      To sum up, Volvo is too small to be everything to everyone, but they will surely generate even more sales with their current line up in 2020. I just hope they develop more fun to drive cars that are not so heavy with the newer generation vehicles to cater for the enthusiasts who would like to drive a Volvo.

    24. #22
      Junior Member
      Join Date
      May 2019
      Posts
      121
      Quote Originally Posted by volvocu View Post
      First lets review some facts:
      1- Volvo is a small manufacturer with relatively little resources, they have chosen to prioritize their investments based on highest return expectations
      2- They have committed to an electrified future, in 5 years they plan to have 50% of their sales made up of BEVs
      3- This path has been demonstrated to be successful AND sustainable

      Therefore do not expect to see anything larger than 4 cylinders.

      OTOH, Volvo’s 4 cylinder engines are rough compared to the Germans’, hence Volvo has decided to collaborate with Geely to develop their next generation ICE. There is also talk now of a possible synergy with Mercedes. Additionally, the then-innovative model of cramming the battery within the “transmission tunnel” has now been surpassed by the Germans thanks to their larger batteries without compromising much on space. They need to improve the technical configuration on the SPA2 platform. What’s more, their plug-in cars are much too heavy, which is the main reason the S60 posted the dismal performance at the drag strip.

      To sum up, Volvo is too small to be everything to everyone, but they will surely generate even more sales with their current line up in 2020. I just hope they develop more fun to drive cars that are not so heavy with the newer generation vehicles to cater for the enthusiasts who would like to drive a Volvo.
      Nice write up. I wish they go that direction too. Been a huge loyal fan and customer but the sedans have become too tame and dull compared to competition. I’d be the first one to get back into a Volvo if they bring back the glory days of Volvo’s actual polestar division. We only need one model. polestar engineered is again just slick marketing for the masses.

    25. #23
      Member volvocu's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jul 2003
      Location
      ISTANBUL
      Posts
      1,967
      They should at least offer the Polestar Engineered package on the S60 T6 for the US market, making around 340 hp with the chassis and brake upgrades should satisfy the crowd, while being arguably a much better drivers car than the T8.

    26. #24
      Junior Member
      Join Date
      Aug 2006
      Posts
      195
      One thing: these BMW engines have even 50 PS more that it is declared. If Volvo has less, everything is clear.

    27. #25
      Member
      Join Date
      Aug 2009
      Location
      Toronto, Canada
      Posts
      2,076
      Quote Originally Posted by Kamil View Post
      Good information, Iím not to familiar with the MB new systems. I did not own one in 10 years.
      Yup the Mercedes MB156 is an amazing engine. It's silky smooth, powerful, and efficient. Everything you want in a luxury vehicle (with a 6 cylinder engine). VAG is also launching new 4 cylinder engines (in Europe) with a 48V mild hybrid system. The new VAG eTSI engines supposed to reduce fuel economy by up to 10%.

      I honestly think it's the way to go right now. The mild hybrid system can get rid of turbo lag, run the water pump, allow the vehicle to coast or cruise without the engine running, and also keep the passenger compartment cool in the summer since all the main electronics are run off the 48V system and small battery inside the engine bay.

      I'm honestly quite surprised BMW didn't develop a similar 48V mild hybrid system for their new 6 cylinders.
      Last edited by geokilla; 01-07-2020 at 07:58 PM. Reason: *electronics. Not electric

    28. #26
      Junior Member Kamil's Avatar
      Join Date
      Nov 2019
      Posts
      804
      Quote Originally Posted by geokilla View Post
      Yup the Mercedes MB156 is an amazing engine. It's silky smooth, powerful, and efficient. Everything you want in a luxury vehicle (with a 6 cylinder engine). VAG is also launching new 4 cylinder engines (in Europe) with a 48V mild hybrid system. The new VAG eTSI engines supposed to reduce fuel economy by up to 10%.

      I honestly think it's the way to go right now. The mild hybrid system can get rid of turbo lag, run the water pump, allow the vehicle to coast or cruise without the engine running, and also keep the passenger compartment cool in the summer since all the main electric are run off the 48V system and small battery inside the engine bay.

      I'm honestly quite surprised BMW didn't develop a similar 48V mild hybrid system for their new 6 cylinders.
      The technology is promising I agree.
      2020 V60 CC

    29. #27
      Junior Member
      Join Date
      Jan 2009
      Posts
      52
      Quote Originally Posted by Kamil View Post
      The technology is promising I agree.
      I would like to have seen a XC60 Polestar design with the 367HP old S60 polestar 4 cyl engine without battery.
      Also the current ASIN shifts like a SMART, slow and horribly when pushed. For normal driving it is good though.
      But boy is the XC90 underpowered even with T6 current engine (316HP)

    30. #28
      Junior Member Kamil's Avatar
      Join Date
      Nov 2019
      Posts
      804
      Part of my regretting not getting the polestar V60 VS the V60CC
      2020 V60 CC

    31. Remove Advertisements

      Advertisements
       

    Similar Threads

    1. are you windows slower than on other volvos?
      By Sia in forum XC90 (SPA: 2016 - )
      Replies: 10
      Last Post: 07-05-2017, 02:12 PM
    2. Why is my V70R is slower than my 850 Turbo?
      By dustinrag in forum R Forum (2004-2007)
      Replies: 46
      Last Post: 05-17-2014, 09:18 AM
    3. R is slower than it used to be... suggestions?
      By binaryf8 in forum R Forum (2004-2007)
      Replies: 23
      Last Post: 10-05-2011, 07:56 AM
    4. 04 V70R auto with IPD tune = Slower than 06 S60R auto??
      By tarmactrr in forum R Forum (2004-2007)
      Replies: 31
      Last Post: 09-03-2008, 10:08 PM
    5. So you think R is slower than everything else in its class
      By flybynight in forum R Forum (2004-2007)
      Replies: 115
      Last Post: 10-31-2007, 04:03 PM