(Discovered) Volvo S90 XC90 XC60 T6/T5 AWD Vibration Issue SPA (AWD) - Propeller Shaft
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    1. #1
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      Thumbs up (Solved) Volvo S90 XC90 XC60 T6/T5 AWD Vibration Issue SPA (AWD) - Propeller Shaft

      Hello everyone,

      In reference with my previous thread regarding the weird vibration that happens at our AWD cars. The link: https://forums.swedespeed.com/showth...Issue-SPA-2018.


      I finally discovered the whole issue of this vibration. Changing the propeller shaft CV joint and the changing the tires did not resolve my vibration issue. Initially, after the dealer changed the front CV joint in the propeller shaft and advised to change the out of round tires was the solution for the whole vibration, however, after buying and installing the new tires the vibration didn't go away.

      This frustrated me so much and I decided to video and record the propeller shaft movement while driving the car. Guess what!! The propeller shaft is moving like the egg while driving the car . No doubt that this will create the weird vibration in the car. Now, in such situation the whole propeller shaft has to be inspected, corrected, and balanced and that should do the trick. However, Volvo should intervene and fix the whole issue of my car and of course under warranty. I'm not paying any single dollar out of my bucket. I have paid enough for my trips to the dealer, balancing, and tire changes .


      After this issue, I do not think an AWD car is worth it. It's just a mess and very costly in repair just like an air suspension. If it breaks, I will dumb everything in the trash and drive my car FWD. My previous S80 didn't cause me such troubles even after driving her for 170K miles.



      To check your car (at your own risk), there are two ways:

      1- Video recording while driving (ensure to use a proper mount and use reliable Jack Stands... Your safety first)

      2- (Not advisable and not recommended) Lifting the car (the whole four wheels) and driving it in the air only by maximum 25 MPH. However, you have to disable the traction and expect the ABS and TPMS lights to illuminate in the clusters. They will turn off automatically after you drive the car on the ground more than 20 MPH.




      Update 2: My discovery today confirmed why the propeller shaft is circulating like an egg. It turned out the donuts (bearing) that hold the propeller shaft are in complete disaster causing the play in the propeller shaft. I'm really not sure when this rubber was broke. Very bad quality rubber. This type of rubber should last more than 100K miles not 1000 miles. Sorry Volvo but you have to recall all the propeller shaft in the market now and ensure the rubber is very strong and will last at least 100K miles. We have wasted enough money in dealer trips, tires, and balancing.

      Anyway... Enjoy watching the below two videos...

      Video 1: The propeller shaft movement while driving the car...




      Video 2: The broken rubber in the bearing of the propeller shaft...









      Here is a video that explains the balancing of the propeller shaft and how it must be perfectly round and straight:

      Last edited by Nerd23; 03-14-2020 at 10:04 AM.

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    3. #2
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      Hopefully with this information they can come up with a fix. I have been through a good deal since November with my S90. 2 Sets of tires, Replacement tire, 5 road force balancing. I contacted Volvo Corp after the dealer I was working with said it was normal for all SPA cars to vibrate. I went to a different dealer, they did a great job and replaced the AOC per the TJ and went over the drive train. My issue has been dramatically reduced. However I still have a vibration above 70, just not nearly as bad as it was. I do wonder though if this is the final piece to the puzzle.

    4. #3
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      Ah yes, just as I suspected. Looks like Volvo got a bad batch of prop shaft from their supplier. Looks like they are avoiding a recall on this as much as they can since this sort of thing is very easily diagnosed.

      OP, you mind record the frequency of your vibration with the app I used in my thread. https://forums.swedespeed.com/showth...op-Shaft-Speed

      If it is the same, that will confirm that this is a widespread issue for this car. I counted the rotation of the prop shaft against the rpm of the wheel, it looks to be abount 2.5ish : 1 for prop shaft vs the wheel, which correspond to the freq of the vibration that I recorded off my car.
      Last edited by cloud9blue; 01-31-2020 at 07:01 PM.
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    6. #4
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      Quote Originally Posted by S90Pitt View Post
      Hopefully with this information they can come up with a fix. I have been through a good deal since November with my S90. 2 Sets of tires, Replacement tire, 5 road force balancing. I contacted Volvo Corp after the dealer I was working with said it was normal for all SPA cars to vibrate. I went to a different dealer, they did a great job and replaced the AOC per the TJ and went over the drive train. My issue has been dramatically reduced. However I still have a vibration above 70, just not nearly as bad as it was. I do wonder though if this is the final piece to the puzzle.
      Check my new video. Your issue might be the same.

    7. #5
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      Quote Originally Posted by cloud9blue View Post
      Ah yes, just as I suspected. Looks like Volvo got a bad batch of prop shaft from their supplier. Looks like they are avoiding a recall on this as much as they can since this sort of thing is very easily diagnosed.

      OP, you mind record the frequency of your vibration with the app I used in my thread. https://forums.swedespeed.com/showth...op-Shaft-Speed

      If it is the same, that will confirm that this is a widespread issue for this car. I counted the rotation of the prop shaft against the rpm of the wheel, it looks to be abount 2.5ish : 1 for prop shaft vs the wheel, which correspond to the freq of the vibration that I recorded off my car.

      That will be a too complicated analysis . After my new video I'm confident that we have found the issue, it's the bad quality bearing rubber that hold the propeller shaft in two locations. If this rubber broke, the shaft will play and dance. Now, the solutions is to replace the whole propeller shaft as these bearings and rubber cannot be installed alone. However, Volvo has to come with a way to replacing these things without the need to replace the whole shaft. The design should more smart and practical.

    8. #6
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      Thank you very much for sharing this information, guys! You helped me a lot, especially with the Tech Journal. I've got the same vibration issue with a V90 D5 AWD Inscription here in Europe/Hungary. Unfortunately, there are no Technical Journals available for us here in Europe. Volvo keeps every single piece of information about repairing and maintenance of their cars as a top secret. There is no way here to have access to VIDA subscription even for a moment, like you have in the US at volvotechinfo.

      Anyway, here is my story:

      The road force balance came up with the following results (18 inch OEM wheels):
      Front L: 40N, R: 65N
      Rear L: 80N, R: 95N
      These values are still acceptable regarding the Tech Journal (The limit is 105N on the V90.)

      I took my car to the dealer, and showed him the Technical Journal you shared.
      1. First they went for a ride, and confirmed that the vibration was there.
      2. Then the Volvo technician suggested to inspect the vibration issue with the propeller shaft detached from the drive train, switching the car to FWD Only mode for a while, just to be sure the vibration is not originating from the front drive shafts. Then they went for a ride, and they claimed that there was no vibration at all -> front drives shafts are OK, Wheels+Tyres are OK.
      3. However, after they reattached the propeller shaft, and on the next ride with AWD they still did not experienced any vibration. Whooops...


      After that I drove the car home, but the traffic was too high, I couldn't really test the vibration. The next day we went for our winter holiday making a 900 km trip with the car, and the vibration was definitely there from the first moment, all way long. So the Tech guys were wrong for sure on their last AWD ride regarding vibration. (I can only hope they were right on their FWD ride...)

      I hope in the coming week my front CV joint on the propeller shaft will be replaced. I will send you an update, how it works.

      Next time they detach the propeller shaft, I should take a ride with the car, and check the vibration myself in FWD mode, just to be sure.
      Last edited by HooPe; 02-08-2020 at 10:44 AM.

    9. #7
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      Quote Originally Posted by HooPe View Post
      Thank you very much for sharing this information, guys! You helped me a lot, especially with the Tech Journal. I've got the same vibration issue with a V90 D5 AWD Inscription here in Europe/Hungary. Unfortunately, there are no Technical Journals are available for us here in Europe. Volvo keeps every single piece of information about repairing and maintenance of their cars as a top secret. There is no way here to have access to VIDA subscription even for a moment, like you have in the US at volvotechinfo.

      Anyway, here is my story:

      The road force balance came up with the following results (18 inch OEM wheels):
      Front L: 40N, R: 65N
      Rear L: 80N, R: 95N
      These values are still acceptable regarding the Tech Journal (The limit is 105N on the V90.)

      I took my car to the dealer, and showed him the Technical Journal you shared.
      1. First they went for a ride, and confirmed that the vibration was there.
      2. Then the Volvo technician suggested to inspect the vibration issue with the propeller shaft detached from the drive train, switching the car to FWD Only mode for a while, just to be sure the vibration is not originating from the front drive shafts. Then they went for a ride, and they claimed that there was no vibration at all -> front drives shafts are OK, Wheels+Tyres are OK.
      3. However, after they reattached the propeller shaft, and on the next ride with AWD they still did not experienced any vibration. Whooops...


      After that I drove the car home, but the traffic was too high, I couldn't really test the vibration. The next day we went for our winter holiday making a 900 km trip with the car, and the vibration was definitely there from the first moment, all way long. So the Tech guys were wrong for sure on their last AWD ride regarding vibration. (I can only hope they were right on their FWD ride...)

      I hope in the coming week my front CV joint on the propeller shaft will be replaced. I will send you an update, how it works.

      Next time they detach the propeller shaft, I should take a ride with the car, and check the vibration myself in FWD mode, just to be sure.

      Don't trust the dealer. You are the one who knows if there is a vibration. My dealer said the same... They removed the shaft and they test drove the car and the vibration was still there. In fact, part of the vibration was because of the bad tires. When I was sure there was something with the drivetrain, I came up with these two videos which confirmed the failing of the Propeller shaft carrier bearing bushings. The dealer changed the head of the drive shaft which did not solve the issue previously. Let them check these bushings to save yourself some time chasing this issue and leading you to change the whole propeller shaft.

      Last edited by Nerd23; 02-07-2020 at 11:04 AM.

    10. #8
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      Have you had the propellor shaft replaced and can confirm that the vibrations are gone?

    11. #9
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      Quote Originally Posted by obermuh View Post
      Have you had the propellor shaft replaced and can confirm that the vibrations are gone?
      It will take a while as the dealer does not carry one at the moment. I gotta wait for sometime..

      I'm confident that will solve it given the disaster rubber condition... But will see.

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      I checked also my bushing rubbers. Here is mine:



      If the main function of this rubber is to keep the shaft in center position, and so prevent eccentric rotation of the shaft, and reducing vibration, I'm afraid it will not fulfil it's purpose. It seems to be very loose, I can move it by hand very easy. I'm going to let them check those rubbers, before changing the propeller shaft head.

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      Quote Originally Posted by HooPe View Post
      I checked also my bushing rubbers. Here is mine:



      If the main function of this rubber is to keep the shaft in center position, and so prevent eccentric rotation of the shaft, and reducing vibration, I'm afraid it will not fulfil it's purpose. It seems to be very loose, I can move it by hand very easy. I'm going to let them check those rubbers, before changing the propeller shaft head.
      Man!!! The bearing rubber of your V90 Propeller Shaft is cracked as well. I'm sure that this gap is not the original design of this rubber. On my car, the crack was not a perfect circle and it was obvious that the rubber cracked itself. This rubber acts just like a control arm bushing. When a bushing fail and crack, it will cause a vibration very easily. BTW what is your car's millage?

      When I showed mine to the dealer, they ordered the propeller shaft right away with no questions because of the play and this obvious crack. I think we are reaching to the Vibration puzzle of all SPA AWD cars. Once these new cars hit the road in their first 1K miles, this rubber will fail directly causing this drivetrain vibration.
      Last edited by Nerd23; 02-08-2020 at 11:11 AM.

    14. #12
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      Quote Originally Posted by Nerd23 View Post
      Man!!! The bearing rubber of your V90 Propeller Shaft is cracked as well. I'm sure that this gap is not the original design of this rubber. On my car, the crack was not a perfect circle and it was obvious that the rubber cracked itself. BTW what is your car's millage?

      When I showed mine to the dealer, they ordered the propeller shaft right away with no questions because of the play and this obvious crack. I think we are reaching to the Vibration puzzle of all SPA AWD cars.
      I hope so! I will not rest until my vibration issues are completely gone. My car's mileage is 97.000 kms (~60.000 miles). As both of those rubbers were so loose, at first sight they were not especially suspicious to me. But now I think they can be the culprits in our vibration issue. Tomorrow I will take some closer shots about the rubbers. It would be nice to have access to the Volvo repair manual for SPA cars, I'm curious what we could find there about this particular issue.

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      Quote Originally Posted by HooPe View Post
      Quote Originally Posted by Nerd23 View Post
      Man!!! The bearing rubber of your V90 Propeller Shaft is cracked as well. I'm sure that this gap is not the original design of this rubber. On my car, the crack was not a perfect circle and it was obvious that the rubber cracked itself. BTW what is your car's millage?

      When I showed mine to the dealer, they ordered the propeller shaft right away with no questions because of the play and this obvious crack. I think we are reaching to the Vibration puzzle of all SPA AWD cars.
      I hope so! <img src="http://www.vwvortex.com/Anthony/Smilies/wink.gif" border="0" alt="" title="Wink" class="inlineimg" /> I will not rest until my vibration issues are completely gone. My car's mileage is 97.000 kms (~60.000 miles). As both of those rubbers were so loose, at first sight they were not especially suspicious to me. But now I think they can be the culprits in our vibration issue. Tomorrow I will take some closer shots about the rubbers. It would be nice to have access to the Volvo repair manual for SPA cars, I'm curious what we could find there about this particular issue.

      Look at this video from John Sadler Auto repair, it describes our issue exactly. Look at the high quality bearing rubber used to be installed in prior SPA Volvo cars.

      https://youtu.be/6APZrJ7s9qc

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      I investigated those bearing rubbers from a bit closer. Here are the pictures I've taken. I must say, these gaps are by design there, they are not cracks, as they seemed to be from our videos. These bearing rubber rings have open gap from the back side of the car, and no gap from the front side.

      The back side of back rubber:


      Front side of the back rubber:


      Back side of the front rubber:


      Front side of the front rubber:


      It is another question if they have any effect on our vibration issue, because they still seem to be quite loose, but this can also be a design consideration we are not aware of. My rubbers seem to be ok, they are not damaged. We should check those rubbers on a car with no vibration issue, how loose they are.
      Last edited by HooPe; 02-09-2020 at 07:54 AM.

    17. #15
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      Quote Originally Posted by HooPe View Post
      I investigated those bearing rubbers from a bit closer. Here are the pictures I've taken. I must say, these gaps are by design there, they are not cracks, as they seemed to be from our videos. These bearing rubber rings have open gap from the back side of the car, and no gap from the front side.

      The back side of back rubber:


      Front side of the back rubber:


      Back side of the front rubber:


      Front side of the front rubber:


      It is another question if they have any effect on our vibration issue, because they still seem to be quite loose, but this can also be a design consideration we are not aware of. My rubbers seem to be ok, they are not damaged. We should check those rubbers on a car with no vibration issue, how loose they are.

      Yeah I agree with you. On your car, there isn't any crack on that rubber. Yours is just designed differently & "Made in Germany". If you could read it. If your tires/wheels are perfect, it might be a good idea to drive the car without the propeller shaft and see if the vibration is gone. It might be the CV joint in the propeller shaft. Or it might be engine mount or the torque rod mount (common issue). The dealer replaced mine. It's in the top right of the engine.


      However, on my car S90 L assampled in China seems to have a different design bearing rubber and lower in quality. I checked my video again and mine doesn't have the same design as yours. The crack or gap was only in half of the rubber circle, which proves it was cracked by the force and heat. Also, it appears that the rubber shrunk in size causing more play. My car is only 30K miles.

      Btw, my propeller shaft is made in china as listed in the Volvo part sticker.
      Last edited by Nerd23; 02-09-2020 at 12:26 PM.

    18. #16
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      Dropping my car off tonight at the dealer. I followed up with them and stated that the vibration on the highway seemed better after the repair but not 100 resolved and has since been getting worse since the AOC replacement. The last few days on the highway the vibration is just as bad as before the repair. The vibration is in the steering, seats, floor, etc. I even felt it at lower speeds along with my passengers.

      I have been working with the lead tech at the dealer and Volvo customer care. My service rep said they are going to open a tech case with Volvo as well. Since we have delved into the wheels, tires, and AOC. I am going to push for them to check the rubber surrounding the carrier bearings and removal and testing without the driveshaft. I took my car up to 90 on the highway and the issue got worse with speed. I will report back on my outcome. I do really like my car, but the vibration on the highway is really affecting my ability to enjoy my car.

    19. #17
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      Quote Originally Posted by S90Pitt View Post
      Dropping my car off tonight at the dealer. I followed up with them and stated that the vibration on the highway seemed better after the repair but not 100 resolved and has since been getting worse since the AOC replacement. The last few days on the highway the vibration is just as bad as before the repair. The vibration is in the steering, seats, floor, etc. I even felt it at lower speeds along with my passengers.

      I have been working with the lead tech at the dealer and Volvo customer care. My service rep said they are going to open a tech case with Volvo as well. Since we have delved into the wheels, tires, and AOC. I am going to push for them to check the rubber surrounding the carrier bearings and removal and testing without the driveshaft. I took my car up to 90 on the highway and the issue got worse with speed. I will report back on my outcome. I do really like my car, but the vibration on the highway is really affecting my ability to enjoy my car.
      Update: Techs removed drive shaft and drove the car, vibration is still present all through the chassis, even without the drive shaft. Next step is adding microphones to various points on the chassis and road testing. Happily still in the XC90 loaner that is smooth as can be on the same highway drive.

    20. #18
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      Quote Originally Posted by S90Pitt View Post
      Update: Techs removed drive shaft and drove the car, vibration is still present all through the chassis, even without the drive shaft. Next step is adding microphones to various points on the chassis and road testing. Happily still in the XC90 loaner that is smooth as can be on the same highway drive.
      Glad that your vibration issue is not coming from the drive shaft. I wonder if you did test drive the car yourself when they removed the propeller shaft?


      Also, just an update regarding my vibration issue. Apparently the propeller shaft is still on the way. However, I discovered a 1 inch crack in the torque rod mount. I went to the dealer and they didn't see the crack at first. They called me out to pin point the crack location . Anyway I showed them the location and they changed it right away under warranty.

      I discovered that 30% of my vibration issue is gone. I had some vibration at Idle and on acceleration. I didn't expect a 1 inch crack will cause some vibration on the car.

      Anyway I will keep you posted after they change that defective propller shaft.


      Here is a picture of the location of the crack on the torque rod. I highly suggest you inspect it really carefully in every section (inner and outer).



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    21. #19
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      Thanks, I did not drive my car with the driveshaft removed. However the master tech that went on the first drive with me said he still noticed the same vibration with and without the driveshaft. He is able to replicate the issue very easily so I at least have that going for me. I will inspect the mount when I have my car again, however it is VERY smooth when I am idling. They indicated that they would have it for a while.

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      Big news on a Dutch Volvo Forum. Since week 46 of last year some modifications have been made to the SPA platform which is in the subframe.
      With these changes the vibrations should be resolved. Unfortunate for the cars manufactured before this week as these modifications cannot be performed on existing cars.
      Link to the website: (see comment Poolrev)
      https://www.volvo-forum.nl/viewtopic...2835&start=240
      Last edited by risrael; 02-18-2020 at 10:54 AM.

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      Quote Originally Posted by risrael View Post
      Big news on a Dutch Volvo Forum. Since week 46 of last year some modifications have been made to the SPA platform which is in the subframe.
      With these changes the vibrations should be resolved. Unfortunate for the cars manufactured before this week as these modifications cannot be performed on existing cars.
      Link to the Dutch forum please? Would love to see how it makes difference, for which power train, T5/T6 AWD/FWD?

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    24. #22
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      Quote Originally Posted by risrael View Post
      Big news on a Dutch Volvo Forum. Since week 46 of last year some modifications have been made to the SPA platform which is in the subframe.
      With these changes the vibrations should be resolved. Unfortunate for the cars manufactured before this week as these modifications cannot be performed on existing cars.
      Yeah I certainly hope that is not the fix...I will be forced into another car at that point. I would like to see the details as well.

    25. #23
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      Quote Originally Posted by risrael View Post
      Big news on a Dutch Volvo Forum. Since week 46 of last year some modifications have been made to the SPA platform which is in the subframe.
      With these changes the vibrations should be resolved. Unfortunate for the cars manufactured before this week as these modifications cannot be performed on existing cars.
      Link to the website: (see comment Poolrev)
      https://www.volvo-forum.nl/viewtopic...2835&start=240
      That doesn't make any sense!! Not all the SPA cars are having the problem. If it was a subframe issue, it will affect all the cars.

      Nonetheless, some SPA cars are very smooth and vibration free across all models V90 S90 S60 XC90.....

      I guess someone just wrote a joke over there!!!





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      Quote Originally Posted by S90Pitt View Post
      Yeah I certainly hope that is not the fix...I will be forced into another car at that point. I would like to see the details as well.
      Don't give up yet. Your S90 loves you!!

      Just an update: my car at the dealer currently and they replaced the propeller shaft finally. They also found two bent wheels again (20" sucks).

      They updated me that the drivetrain vibration is gone. However, there is some vibration left from the two bent wheels.

      Anyway, I will not trust what they are saying until I test drive the car myself. I can easily distinguish between the drivetrain vibration from the bent wheel vibration.

      I will fix the bent wheels as well before sharing any final results of solving this puzzle.

      I will keep you posted.

      Cheers...

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      Quote Originally Posted by Nerd23 View Post
      Don't give up yet. Your S90 loves you!!

      Just an update: my car at the dealer currently and they replaced the propeller shaft finally. They also found two bent wheels again (20" sucks).

      They updated me that the drivetrain vibration is gone. However, there is some vibration left from the two bent wheels.

      Anyway, I will not trust what they are saying until I test drive the car myself. I can easily distinguish between the drivetrain vibration from the bent wheel vibration.

      I will fix the bent wheels as well before sharing any final results of solving this puzzle.

      I will keep you posted.

      Cheers...

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      Good Luck. I am glad I have the 19inch rims and not 20's. My car is still at the dealer. I see according to the app that it is back in the shop today. I sure hope they are able to figure it out. I really miss my car.

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      Well I reached the end of the road. I got my car back after they replaced the rear differential and the torsional damper again. I got on the highway and the car vibrated just the same (Seats, Floor, Steering). I now feel it from 60 and up. Since I have only had my car since the end of October and I have put over two grand into this situation (New Tires, New front Rotors, 5 Road Force Balancing) I decided to trade it in on a new car. I lost a bit of money but the Audi I purchased is unbelievably smooth and the tech is a cut above. I wish the rest of you luck in resolving your issue. I really hope that Volvo is able to resolve these quality issues. I loved the looks of my S90, but I know that this issue would eat away at me. Also for what it is worth I absolutely recommend Star Volvo in Greensburg, PA. They truly went above and beyond to try and resolve my issue. I do not blame them for the lack of a fix, they did everything by the books and then some.

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      Quote Originally Posted by S90Pitt View Post
      Well I reached the end of the road. I got my car back after they replaced the rear differential and the torsional damper again. I got on the highway and the car vibrated just the same (Seats, Floor, Steering). I now feel it from 60 and up. Since I have only had my car since the end of October and I have put over two grand into this situation (New Tires, New front Rotors, 5 Road Force Balancing) I decided to trade it in on a new car. I lost a bit of money but the Audi I purchased is unbelievably smooth and the tech is a cut above. I wish the rest of you luck in resolving your issue. I really hope that Volvo is able to resolve these quality issues. I loved the looks of my S90, but I know that this issue would eat away at me. Also for what it is worth I absolutely recommend Star Volvo in Greensburg, PA. They truly went above and beyond to try and resolve my issue. I do not blame them for the lack of a fix, they did everything by the books and then some.
      Very sad to hear that... Let us know which car did you like more, the Audi or the Volvo .

      Btw, I owend 2013 Audi A6 3.0T fully loaded. The transmission computer (mechatroinc unit) failed at around 43k miles. The fix was around $4,200!!! After some discussion back and forth with Audi they replaced it free of charge. All bushings of the S line package was completely broken and rubbish that caused vibration on the car at very low mileage. VW have also the same issue with bushings. Mercedes is the only one that produce very high quality bushings that will last forever.

      Then, I decided to sell my Audi and get the Volvo S90. I had a good and satisfactory experience with Volvo. I owned a 2007 Volvo S80 before I bought the Audi and it surprisingly survived for around 10 years/170K miles with very minor issues. No news about it after being sold.


      Anyway, ensure you have extended warranty for your Audi. However, I trust that Audi have improved things right now compared with before. Good luck!

    30. #28
      Junior Member S90Pitt's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by Nerd23 View Post
      Very sad to hear that... Let us know which car did you like more, the Audi or the Volvo .

      Btw, I owend 2013 Audi A6 3.0T fully loaded. The transmission computer (mechatroinc unit) failed at around 43k miles. The fix was around $4,200!!! After some discussion back and forth with Audi they replaced it free of charge. All bushings of the S line package was completely broken and rubbish that caused vibration on the car at very low mileage. VW have also the same issue with bushings. Mercedes is the only one that produce very high quality bushings that will last forever.

      Then, I decided to sell my Audi and get the Volvo S90. I had a good and satisfactory experience with Volvo. I owned a 2007 Volvo S80 before I bought the Audi and it surprisingly survived for around 10 years/170K miles with very minor issues. No news about it after being sold.


      Anyway, ensure you have extended warranty for your Audi. However, I trust that Audi have improved things right now compared with before. Good luck!
      Thanks! I had a Volvo V70XC and my mom had a 2005 S60 back in the day and we loved those cars. I am bummed that things didnt work out, but the car was just becoming a source of stress and I decided to make a move now vs further down the road. I went with an A4 Premium Plus Quattro. It is smaller than the S90, by alot. However I had a 2016 3 series before the S90 and the Audi has more room. I will always carry and extended warranty. I am in the process of cancelling my VIP warranty and will take those proceeds to apply to the Audi. So far I have put about 250 miles on the A4 over the weekend and it is fantastically smooth, but that is kinda to be expected. Time will tell in the long run. I normally keep my cars about 4-5 years for my daily driver. The fit and finish is great on the Audi and I am really enjoying the sport seats, virtual cockpit, and MMI interface. It is very speedy compared to our version of Sensus with one exception, Bluetooth takes about 30 seconds to connect. Everything else is ready to go. I did experience the upgraded Sensus in a few 2020's and it is much improved.

    31. #29
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      Anyway guys new update....

      I test drove my car at the dealer and things have improved very well. 70 % of the vibrations issues are gone amazingly. The car felt more solid and smooth right now.

      Here is the list of the things that have been replaced:

      1- Right torque rod part#31430195. Info: Prior to replacing the propeller shaft, there was a crack on this mount. Changing the mount reduced vibration on idle and hard acceleration.

      2- Whole propeller shaft part#31437055. Info: replacing the propeller shaft reduced the vibration issue heavily given the broken bearing rubber, per the dealer note.

      3- Left torque rod part# 31330594. Info: The dealer noticed some vibration left after changing the propeller shaft. The mount was very weak and needed to be replaced.

      The result: all of these items reduced the vibration issue heavily and direct the dealer to the root cause of the problem. Now, there is no vibration under hard acceleration at all speeds. There's no vibration on idle as well.



      The rest of the vibration issue: This only comes when pressing the gas pedal gently (1/5) or coasting, at all speeds (15 miles to 80 miles). It appears to be coming from the rear of the car somewhere in the rear differential. It feels like something is dancing on the rear or something that is not circulating in pure circle motion.

      My evaluation, this issue is what caused the propeller shaft to fail. There seems to be misalignment somewhere in the rear differential that is causing the vibration issue. It might be the axle shaft on the rear or the whole differential components are faulty.


      Anyway, the dealer noticed that vibration as well and they are preparing a technical report to be shared with Volvo technical help-desk and Volvo engineers before taking any further step or making any warranty claim. The dealer technician are really keen to solve my car issue. They are taking care of my car just as if it was one of their cars. I trust them now to solve the rest of the issue. Will keep you updated!!!

    32. #30
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      Quote Originally Posted by S90Pitt View Post
      Thanks! I had a Volvo V70XC and my mom had a 2005 S60 back in the day and we loved those cars. I am bummed that things didnt work out, but the car was just becoming a source of stress and I decided to make a move now vs further down the road. I went with an A4 Premium Plus Quattro. It is smaller than the S90, by alot. However I had a 2016 3 series before the S90 and the Audi has more room. I will always carry and extended warranty. I am in the process of cancelling my VIP warranty and will take those proceeds to apply to the Audi. So far I have put about 250 miles on the A4 over the weekend and it is fantastically smooth, but that is kinda to be expected. Time will tell in the long run. I normally keep my cars about 4-5 years for my daily driver. The fit and finish is great on the Audi and I am really enjoying the sport seats, virtual cockpit, and MMI interface. It is very speedy compared to our version of Sensus with one exception, Bluetooth takes about 30 seconds to connect. Everything else is ready to go. I did experience the upgraded Sensus in a few 2020's and it is much improved.
      At least now you have a very smooth car... The A4 is easier to service and maintain compared with A6. It shares so many parts with VW Jetta or Passat. No worries in reliability regards.



      Anyway, I totally agree chasing that vibration consumes time and effort but I ain't giving up. I'm confident it can be solved with a little of patience and good dealer. So far, I'm totally satisfied with the results that we have achieved. That 30% vibration will get resolved soon. Just wait for the results if you are curious about it.

      Sent from my YAL-L21 using Tapatalk

    33. #31
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      I'm interested in reading the technical report your dealer drafts after the remaining work is completed. I believe mine has a slight vibration, but I don't think as severely as yours was. I'm thinking of having an independent Volvo mechanic look over the prop/half/drive shafts for any oscillation. I don't feel it through the steering wheel, but it is slight seemingly just through the chassis, but it could be the roads. Makes me want to take a test drive in a new Volvo and then drive mine directly afterwards, but who knows? I think showing the independent mechanic your video and this thread will probably direct them more aptly to what I'm hoping they won't find as an issue on my car.
      It sucks you have to go through all of this, but this is a great service you're doing for the community. Thank you!

    34. #32
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      Quote Originally Posted by ShannonSwede View Post
      I'm interested in reading the technical report your dealer drafts after the remaining work is completed. I believe mine has a slight vibration, but I don't think as severely as yours was. I'm thinking of having an independent Volvo mechanic look over the prop/half/drive shafts for any oscillation. I don't feel it through the steering wheel, but it is slight seemingly just through the chassis, but it could be the roads. Makes me want to take a test drive in a new Volvo and then drive mine directly afterwards, but who knows? I think showing the independent mechanic your video and this thread will probably direct them more aptly to what I'm hoping they won't find as an issue on my car.
      It sucks you have to go through all of this, but this is a great service you're doing for the community. Thank you!
      I would advise you first to check both torque rod mount. These created some vibration even with a very small crack on one of them. They are cheap to replace. You can try two new ones. If it wasn't the cause for your vibration, sell them on ebay or here. That will save you some trip and argument with the dealer.

      I think these have failed/became weak on my car since 20k miles only!!!


      If it didn't work, escalate things with the dealer to check the whole drivetrain and propller shaft.

      Sent from my YAL-L21 using Tapatalk

    35. #33
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      Anyway regarding that bearing rubber. I think the reason why it failed was because of some misalignment between the propeller shaft and the rear differential (final drive). I think the angle of the rear differential is wrong from the factory. This created some pressure on the bearing rubber when the propllershaft was circulating and caused it to fail miserably.

      Also, I'm not sure yet whether the soft rubber of the bearing is real issue since there are some SPA cars are vibration free and they are using the same bearing rubber.


      I'm currently investigating everything in the back of the car. I'm pushing the dealer to remove the rear two axle shaft and see if the vibration goes away. Per their note, the rear differential is fine.

      If not, this confirms the misalignment issue between the propeller shaft and the rear differential. If this is the case I have to solve this issue at home by installing some washers (shims) to tilt the rear differential up and down OR right and left. Until the vibration goes away. You can see the below picture the number of bolts holding rear differential (I hope I highlighted them correctly).



      Sent from my YAL-L21 using Tapatalk

    36. #34
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      Update 3:

      Sad news for everyone...

      I went to the dealer today to test drive two other S90 as advised by the dealer, as follow:

      1- Brand new 2019 S90 T5 AWD with only 23 miles on it. Assambled in China.

      2- Used 2019 S90 T6 AWD with 13,000 miles on it. Assambled in China.

      The sad news: Both S90 exhibited the same vibration problem as my car (2018 S90 T6 AWD). However, the higher the mileage, the worse the vibration.

      Vibration symptoms: It only comes when pressing the gas pedal gently (1/5) or coasting, at all speeds (15 miles to 80 miles). It appears to be coming from the rear of the car somewhere in the rear differential. It feels like something is dancing on the rear or something that is not circulating in pure circle motion. It feels like a wobble or bent wheel. Here is more details:

      1- Changing the gear from D to N does not change the vibration behavior.

      2- The higher the load on the proplershaft, the less the vibration (hard accelerations are smooth)

      3- The vibration does happen when cruising on the highway at 60 or 75 miles per hour. Once you try to accelrate a little, that vibration comes.

      4- best way to check the vibration at very low speed (15 to 30 miles). Try to acclerate slowly, then take off the gas pedal and so on...

      5- The vibration is coming exactly from rear of the car. I notice it more on the rear right side.

      6- All the tech at the dealer said this is not normal. The head tech said the same thing as well. They didn't feel such vibration on any other brand of cars (Mercedes, BMW, Audi...).


      My evaluation to the issue: I'm not an engineer but a business graduate. However, I can easily see where the vibration problem is coming from. There is a pure missallighment between the propeller shaft and the rear differential and axles. I doubt the vertical angle is not correct (up or down). I doubt as well the propeller shaft doesn't hit the rear differential in 90 degree (perpendicular on each other). I think this why there is a vibration.

      What's next?
      The dealer tech are going to test a FWD S90 to confirm if this vibration is AWD realted. Once they check this, they will prepare a technical report for Volvo and ask them for a solution for the issue. So, Volvo solution for sure will take a while...

      If the dealer confirmed that it's only AWD vehicles have the issue, I will use my business knowledge to align that proplershaft angle with the rear differential. I will take a ruler and ensure everything is aligned as engineered.

      I will combine all my write up and do a report and send it to Volvo as well. I will do everything to enjoy my beautiful S90. I'm not giving up. Period.



      Sent from my YAL-L21 using Tapatalk

    37. #35
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      It is NOT AWD related. FWD S/V90 and S/V60 drivers report exactly the same thing.

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