Another 4C vs coilover question......
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    1. #1
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      Another 4C vs coilover question......

      Hey guys, semi-proud owner of a 2004 R with the "venerable" AW55 here. I have used various search features and the responses seem all over the place regarding the following questions so i figured i'd bring them up to see mainly if there is any more definitive information available as of now. Facebook groups seem to be of very little help.

      First: I am sick of the "crashing" over bumps. I've replaced the upper shock mounts, sway bar links, bushings, subframe bushings, based on available information, this seems to be a normal issue. I am sick of it. I've tried moving the accelerometers for the front shocks to the chassis and that helped only slightly. I can still tell a significant difference in overall handling when changing between the three settings on the dash, but otherwise I expect the only improvement I'll ever find is with new front struts at 350-450 each plus a trip to the dealer for SUM calibration. Currently the car sits on mild Eibach springs and is properly aligned. This information seem correct? Am I missing anything?

      Second: I've seen mention of this problem being somewhat well-known. Driving over bumps, a problem in the rear that presents itself as "crab-walking", for lack of a better term, rears its head. Its rather annoying and doesnt inspire confidence in taking curves at any moderate rate of speed. This is disappointing as i've installed some really nice tires as well as IPD's rear sway bar and would like to take advantage of those upgrades. Those of you that have experienced this, what was your solution? Is it a sign that the REAR shocks are worn out as well? (Another 350-450) Or is this another "quirk of the S60R". Im hoping its the former and not the latter. I cannot imagine volvo would design a car with such horrible handling characteristics.

      If the general consensus is that all 4 shocks are in need of replacement (none are leaking, and there is still a noticeable difference between the three suspension settings), I've also read that these things are usually only good for 2 years or so.... Is that normal? 2 years? I mean I guess in two years another 1200 wont be a bad idea, and I'd like to keep the suspension adjustment functional, but a set of BC coilovers is only a grand although I'd upgrade to Swift springs and choose different rates also, they would likely last alot longer than 2 years (maybe?).

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    3. #2
      Junior Member Rodtheviking's Avatar
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      I just replaced my fronts with a low mileage used pair and it made a big difference. No calibration needed. I have the Eibach springs, new top mounts, bump stops etc. I also installed the IPD rear camber bushings and that got rid of the side hopping rear.
      I will be installing the powerflex bushings number 5 and 8 to tighten up the rear as well.

    4. #3
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      The crashing issue is caused by worn struts and soft springs. Either stiffer springs and new struts or switch to coilovers.

      The wandering feel is an alignment issue, possibly caused by worn bushings (most likely control arm). New bushings all around, and then a good alignment.

      Oh yeah, and make sure the rear subframe bolts are tight.

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    6. #4
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      Well the bushings look great all around, I installed the IPD toe rods as well as the offset camber bushings in the rear, the alignment is in the green all around. I guess I'll look into some front struts and see how cheap i can get them. Since they are made by monroe a local parts manager at autozone is going to see how low he can get the cost.

    7. #5
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      Quote Originally Posted by nextproject View Post
      I've also read that these things are usually only good for 2 years or so.... Is that normal? 2 years?
      I don't know where you read that, who posted it, or what type of roads they drive on, but it certainly has not been my experience. I'm the original owner and I replaced the front struts in 2014 at around 92,000 miles because I was in there to replace the failed strut mounts and might as well replace the struts as long as it was all apart, even though they were still 100% functional. The rears are still the factory originals at 127,000 miles with no discernible issues. So the front replacements are now 6 years old with nearly 35,000 miles. Maybe it's the smooth roads here in Phoenix.
      2006 V70R MT
      Sonic Blue / Gobi
      Original owner

    8. #6
      Junior Member TristanScott's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by nextproject View Post
      Well the bushings look great all around, I installed the IPD toe rods as well as the offset camber bushings in the rear, the alignment is in the green all around. I guess I'll look into some front struts and see how cheap i can get them. Since they are made by monroe a local parts manager at autozone is going to see how low he can get the cost.
      You have to get the rear toe dead on. "In the green" is not accurate enough. Where are you going for alignments? I used to have a lifetime firestone alignment and they got the job done but now with my modified suspension I take it to this indy guy. I told him of the issue and he got my alignment spot on and that issue is no longer present at all, car handles so nice right now.

      With worn out springs and no way to individually height adjust in the rear, you might have one side higher or lower than the other which will affect the camber as well so maybe some new springs would do the trick?

      If you're main goal is to reduce crashiness (make the car more comfortable) than you might not want to go with coilovers. You can set them up to be soft but in general it is a firmer ride and can be jarring over rough city roads. I would get the coilovers only if you're main goal is to make the car handle better when driving aggressively or through corners.
      2004 S60R M66 Electric Silver Nordkap
      Stage 2 Contrast Tune, Snabb Intercooler/Charge Pipes/Tial Recirc, Snabb Downpipe, IPD Catback
      KW V2s, Kaplhenke Front Strut Mounts with 2.5" springs, PDV Rear Strut Mounts with KW springs, IPD V70R Track Spec Sway Bars, IPD Rear Toe Links, Kaplhenke Delrin Front Subframe Bushings, Powerflex Race Bushings almost everywhere
      TTV SMF with 06/07 Volvo Clutch, IPD SS Brake Lines

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      2004 V70 2.4 NA AW-55 FWD Ruby Red Metallic

    9. #7
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      Check out my posts here:
      https://forums.swedespeed.com/showth...ght=mnopracing

      Essentially the front OE springs are really soft, so when your going over large bumps or cracks in the pavement the 4c stiffens up to counteract the soft spring wanting to compress quickly. This also seems to be why the car likes to side hop (what you refereed to as crab walking).

      I put in these front springs:
      https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/vol...ng-v70-4095831

      No more side hop (as the rear shocks also get their commands from the front accelerators) and no more crashyness. I've had the wagon on these springs for a while now, maybe 15,000 miles and it still rides beautifully.
      Last edited by MnOpRacInG; 05-30-2020 at 10:00 PM.

    10. #8
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      I should also note my 4c shocks have about 28,000 miles on them and I'm running IPD sways and sub frame insert bushings.

    11. #9
      Member Paisley Pirate's Avatar
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      4C are good for a lot of miles, and, when new, don't have the crabbing feel, crashing, etc. They're still a strut after all.
      That said, I am still amazed how much better the BCs are over the 4Cs and how much better behaved my R is in most conditions.
      It doesn't mind the brick street I moved onto a couple years ago, that is the shortest route to work. Old 4C was hating it.

      Sent from my BBB100-1 using Tapatalk
      2004 S60R Silver, Nordkap, (Currently Dipped Swedish Flag) 18" Enkei RSF5's, FMIC, Snabb MAF to turbo, IPD catback, BC Coilovers, this is Volvo #16
      1st Car - 1965 122S Amazon! A Volvo saved my life - 9/12/94
      My Office Chair is Atacama!

    12. #10
      Member HunterBD's Avatar
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      Another 4C vs coilover question......

      I just did an entire refresh on the whole suspension. TME’s with new 4C’s, iPD sways (25/28mm), HD end links, inserts for subframe. Brakes, rotors and parking brake. It all has been replaced. I didn’t do my Powerflex yet as this suspension is tight. I will replace 5&8 at some time. I also have a upper and rear strut bar.
      I don’t have hop, at all or crashing. I have Michelin’s with 18” Pegs. The car sticks to the road. The stiffer TME’s help with that. Your suspension is tired. If you want to correct it then replace everything, including wheel hubs. How many miles?
      Buy from FCPEURO. They have entire kits for front and rear. Then you have a lifetime warranty.

      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
      Last edited by HunterBD; 06-01-2020 at 01:10 PM. Reason: Adding more info.
      05 VR GT Titanium Grey/Nordakp, sunroof, Winter Package, Premium sound with Volvo Sub. VST rear brace, Ultra Racing front strut brace. iPD Sways and other little upgrades they have. EST DP with Touring Exhaust.

    13. #11
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      Quote Originally Posted by MnOpRacInG View Post
      I read your original post, but I have to ask: what makes these springs HD? Did you happen to measure the wire diameter and compared them to stock before you installed them?
      My cars: '04 S60R, '89 Vanagon Westy, '87 Saab 900, '86 Saab 900, '67 123GT, '66 122S

    14. #12
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      They have a stiffer rate, slightly larger in diameter and are physically longer. Nothing huge, probably 10% stiffer, 5% larger diameter and 10% longer over OE springs.
      I didn't happen to measure them when they were off the car, just had a hunch and wanted them in the car ASAP to see if it worked.

      At any rate they are stiff and long (heh) enough to make the 4c behave properly without going to the TME springs (which are really good springs, just too low for where I live).

      They are supposedly meant for FWD applications for wagons hauling heavy loads and the stock springs are too weak to do the job.
      I have the same companies HD rear springs in my 98 V70T5, same deal. Slightly taller, stiffer and thicker.

      I will say these HD springs are really just to make the 4c work properly and have a nice GT wagon. If you actually want a significant handling increase go with the TME springs or coilovers.
      Last edited by MnOpRacInG; 06-02-2020 at 06:04 PM.

    15. #13
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      K, thanks.
      My cars: '04 S60R, '89 Vanagon Westy, '87 Saab 900, '86 Saab 900, '67 123GT, '66 122S

    16. #14
      Junior Member RuffTuff_95's Avatar
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      I just replaced mine over the weekend. After hours upon hours of research on this forum, I went with the bcracing coilovers. Spring rates of 7kg front 12kg rear using the BC spings and not the Swift springs. I also changed the front endlinks and installed IPD Subrame bushing inserts and got an alignment. Now the front end feels really tight! In terms of ride I would say that it is firm and planted, no crashing whatsoever. I'm still playing around with the dampening settings to find one that I like the best. I have the Chassis Service Setting warning light but it doesn't bother me and honestly I don't miss the 4C. It was worth the tradeoff.

    17. #15
      Junior Member lan's Avatar
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      My BCRacing Coilovers arrive next week. Any pointers for someone about to do the install themselves?
      2004 S60R Ti Gray / Atacama, M66, Climate, Premium, 18" Black Pegs, Stuff and Junk and Things

    18. #16
      Junior Member RuffTuff_95's Avatar
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      The rear shocks are a pain to get out. I had my friend with me jumping on one of the arms so I could have enough space to maneuver it in a way that it would clear. There is also a video on YouTube where you use ratcheting straps to pull down the control arms to give you enough space for it to slide out. Also inside the trunk to access the bols for the top of the strut tower there is a part of the opening of the metal that needs to be either bent up or cut to make space for the adjustment knob for the coilover. I bent mine out of the way using vice grips. As well in regards to the rear. The 4C sensor clip is a bit of a pain to get at because its tucked up in the chassis. There's a YouTube video of that too. Good luck!

    19. #17
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      Quote Originally Posted by RuffTuff_95 View Post
      Also inside the trunk
      What is this trunk of which you speak?
      2006 V70R MT
      Sonic Blue / Gobi
      Original owner

    20. #18
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      Quote Originally Posted by nextproject View Post
      Hey guys, semi-proud owner of a 2004 R with the "venerable" AW55 here. I have used various search features and the responses seem all over the place regarding the following questions so i figured i'd bring them up to see mainly if there is any more definitive information available as of now. Facebook groups seem to be of very little help.

      First: I am sick of the "crashing" over bumps. I've replaced the upper shock mounts, sway bar links, bushings, subframe bushings, based on available information, this seems to be a normal issue. I am sick of it. I've tried moving the accelerometers for the front shocks to the chassis and that helped only slightly. I can still tell a significant difference in overall handling when changing between the three settings on the dash, but otherwise I expect the only improvement I'll ever find is with new front struts at 350-450 each plus a trip to the dealer for SUM calibration. Currently the car sits on mild Eibach springs and is properly aligned. This information seem correct? Am I missing anything?

      Second: I've seen mention of this problem being somewhat well-known. Driving over bumps, a problem in the rear that presents itself as "crab-walking", for lack of a better term, rears its head. Its rather annoying and doesnt inspire confidence in taking curves at any moderate rate of speed. This is disappointing as i've installed some really nice tires as well as IPD's rear sway bar and would like to take advantage of those upgrades. Those of you that have experienced this, what was your solution? Is it a sign that the REAR shocks are worn out as well? (Another 350-450) Or is this another "quirk of the S60R". Im hoping its the former and not the latter. I cannot imagine volvo would design a car with such horrible handling characteristics.

      If the general consensus is that all 4 shocks are in need of replacement (none are leaking, and there is still a noticeable difference between the three suspension settings), I've also read that these things are usually only good for 2 years or so.... Is that normal? 2 years? I mean I guess in two years another 1200 wont be a bad idea, and I'd like to keep the suspension adjustment functional, but a set of BC coilovers is only a grand although I'd upgrade to Swift springs and choose different rates also, they would likely last alot longer than 2 years (maybe?).
      Save your money. 1. Bilstien struts up front w stock springs w resistor mod and used rear shock if yours are leaking. The end.

      Also no disrespect to BC but it is Chinese crap. Not only is China not a friend of the USA - but the BC’s are not a set it and forget it solution. If you must go coilovers fkn KW’s man!! Tire rack or your favorite online store.
      04 V70R M66

    21. #19
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      Quote Originally Posted by JCN View Post
      Also no disrespect to BC but it is Chinese crap. Not only is China not a friend of the USA - but the BC’s are not a set it and forget it solution. If you must go coilovers fkn KW’s man!! Tire rack or your favorite online store.
      Taiwan is not China, and Taiwan IS a friend of the States - no need to start a diplomatic incident here
      2006 Sonic Blue / Nordkapp V70R GT, custom made exhaust and 3" Downpipe, IPD sways, Powerflex bushings all around, Delrin front subframe bushings, BC Racing Coilovers

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