New 2020 S90 R-Design or 2018 BMW 640i GT?
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    1. #1
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      New 2020 S90 R-Design or 2018 BMW 640i GT?

      All - input appreciated on new vehicle options:

      We currently drive a 2018 S90 Momentum (Silver/Amber) and our lease is about to expire. We chose this car partly because of our great experience with our 2014 XC60 R-Design (LOVE that car and engine...fun and very reliable, now with 100,000 miles) but MOSTLY because of the massive rear legroom. We have a tall family with two large, late teenage boys. We love sedans and there aren't many options that are truly long wheelbase (LWB) in the U.S.D.M. Even the Lincoln and Cadillac large sedan offerings don't offer this level of legroom. When we selected the car, I was EXTREMELY aggravated that Volvo didn't offer the R-Design trim in the U.S., so though we really like the utility and general aesthetics of the car, we've never really loved it. In particular, I really despise the T6 powertrain...this is a great sedan in search of an equally great 6 or 8 cylinder engine.

      So, choices for 2020...

      2018 BMW 640i Gran Turismo
      So when looking for any and all LWB options for 2020, which are still slim, I remembered the quirky 2018-2019 BMW 640i Gran Turismo (it was discontinued in the U.S. market after 2019, but continues on worldwide - a refresh for the 2021 model was just unveiled). It is the replacement for the seriously awkward previous 5 series GT, but now rebranded as a 6-series and completely redesigned. It's essentially the 540i sedan mechanicals built on a 7-series platform, so it also has a HUGE amount of rear legroom. It is one of BMW's strange in-between, niche market cars: it's long wheelbase, but in a hatchback/fastback profile that some find awkward, but I find quite appealing. It adds a lot of utility without being a wagon or SAV or SUV. So, my thoughts:

      Pros: more power/quicker, phenomenal engine (BMW's silky, powerful B58 incline 6 cylinder), hatchback utility, large backseat, luxury interior (less restrained Volvo and more extrovert BMW), probably more rare than even the elusive S90, in some ways more sporty/adventurous than the S90 (i.e. it's well suited to just throw my bike in the back hatch), wireless charging and wireless Apple CarPlay, less expensive (about $42K in the market with the options I'm looking for), Certified warranty
      Cons: used only - though Certified (only made two model years in the U.S.), not as attractive as the S90, interior is luxurious - but in many ways dated compared to the Swedish interior (but then again, whose isn't!)

      2020 Volvo S90 R-Design
      We initially had NO desire to get another S90, partly because we just wanted to try something different, and perhaps mostly since the S90 remains completely unchanged since 2018. However, our local dealer has the EXACT car I wanted in 2018...white, R-Design, slick black interior with contrast stitching, along with options we don't currently have (B&O, HUD, etc), and they're offering it for essentially the exact same lease as our current 2018 even though it has a lot more equipment...so in essence, though I'm not super excited about getting the same car again, the 2020 models, and this one in particular now ADD all of the things that were missing in our 2018 model that had left us wanting....

      Pros: new car, R-Design now available, beautiful exterior (not a better looking sedan on the road), stunning interior
      Cons: not sure I want to drive the same car again, more expensive than the BMW ($56K), still terrible T6 power plant, less utility as a sedan vs. hatchback

      So I'm torn...the S90 is objectively the better choice, and is now what I always wanted it to be, but I feel compelled to try something different. Thoughts?
      2014 BMW 335i M-Sport/6MT
      2014 Volvo XC60 R-Design
      2018 Audi S4
      2020 Volvo S90 R-Design/Polestar

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    3. #2
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      I would get it just for the B&O system. I have had my fair share of prestige marquees with upgraded sound systems ( Meridian, Naim, HK, Burmese high end 3D surround eyc..) and this B&O system in the recently purchased V90 CC is just outstanding. Only the mercs Burmester comes close or on par( the merc system has more configurability).

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    4. #3
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      The B&O is one big plus to the S90. The 640i GT under consideration has the Harman Kardon upgrade (same as our 2014 BMW 335i), and it is "okay" but certainly not the equal to the Volvo B&O. Interestingly, I believe the 640i GT can be had with a top-tier spec even above the HK, but not sure it's available in the U.S.
      2014 BMW 335i M-Sport/6MT
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    6. #4
      Global Moderator GrecianVolvo's Avatar
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      There no B&O in any Volvo; the top of the line system is Bowers & Wilkins which I think is at least equal or better to the B&O; Bowers & Wilkins has more speakers and higher output.
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    7. #5
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      Quote Originally Posted by GrecianVolvo View Post
      There no B&O in any Volvo; the top of the line system is Bowers & Wilkins which I think is at least equal or better to the B&O; Bowers & Wilkins has more speakers and higher output.
      Ah...good catch. Yes, "B+W"!!
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      Considering your handle, why not a used Audi A7? I know the 2019's have a horrid delayed throttle response issue. But the earlier models might not. The liftback strikes me as very practical. A new one is on my list for 2022 when the warranty on my V90CC expires.

    9. #7
      Junior Member Catfiend's Avatar
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      So looks and the sound system are on the Volvo's side, but you hate the engine? Is it more important to look at/listen to or drive? I know where I'd come down on that one but that's just me. Oh, and $14k would pay for a nice trip once travel becomes a thing again.
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    10. #8
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      Quote Originally Posted by VLD1 View Post
      Considering your handle, why not a used Audi A7? I know the 2019's have a horrid delayed throttle response issue. But the earlier models might not. The liftback strikes me as very practical. A new one is on my list for 2022 when the warranty on my V90CC expires.
      I think the A7 is a phenomenal vehicle, but it doesn't have NEARLY the rear legroom of the S90 or even 640i GT...unless they radically modified the new version. I think the last one I sat in was the last generation.
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      Quote Originally Posted by Catfiend View Post
      So looks and the sound system are on the Volvo's side, but you hate the engine? Is it more important to look at/listen to or drive? I know where I'd come down on that one but that's just me. Oh, and $14k would pay for a nice trip once travel becomes a thing again.
      So you'd go with the BMW for both driving dynamics and cost savings...not bad logic at all.
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    12. #10
      Global Moderator GrecianVolvo's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by AudiA4 View Post
      I think the A7 is a phenomenal vehicle, but it doesn't have NEARLY the rear legroom of the S90 or even 640i GT...unless they radically modified the new version. I think the last one I sat in was the last generation.
      Other than a Volvo, I think the A7 is an awesome car; I love the way it looks and it also drives well. It's probably one of the best looking cars, out there.
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    13. #11
      Global Moderator GrecianVolvo's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by VLD1 View Post
      Considering your handle, why not a used Audi A7? I know the 2019's have a horrid delayed throttle response issue. But the earlier models might not. The liftback strikes me as very practical. A new one is on my list for 2022 when the warranty on my V90CC expires.
      On the same token, you can find a low mileage S90 T8 Inscription, plug in Hybrid, AWD, low miles, Certified and for under $42K....great buy!
      2001 Volvo V70 T5 M SR, Classic Red/Graphite Lthr, TME Stage II ECU, 3" Downpipe w/ Cat-back exhaust from MTE, Volvo Roadholding & Lowering Kit w/ Nivomats, 17" PEGASUS, Rear Spoiler, Dolby Surround Sound
      2019 V90 Cross Country Osmium Grey metallic w/ Charcoal L, Advance, Retractable Tow Hitch, Polestar, 19" wheels
      2019 S60 T6 AWD Inscription Black w/ Maroon/Brown L, Advanced, Heated Seats/Steering, Charcoal Headliner, Park Assist Pilot, 4C, Ext Styling Kit, 19" wheels, Polestar

    14. #12
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      Quote Originally Posted by GrecianVolvo View Post
      Other than a Volvo, I think the A7 is an awesome car; I love the way it looks and it also drives well. It's probably one of the best looking cars, out there.
      I agree, and coincidentally, my wife and I went yesterday to check out an A6/A7...thinking maybe they stretched the interior a bit on the new model debut in 2019. I'll have to say, the legroom was surprising in both - definitely an improvement over the previous model.

      I much prefer the A7 styling, but form over function, right? The A7 has about an inch less legroom (they moved it forward compared to the A6 to avoid the sloping roofline), and the headroom is about 1.5" lower, also because of the roofline. We sat in the A6, and wow, I was surprised...of course, it isn't quite as much rear legroom, but the 2" different in stated specs seems about right, so to us, that's in the ballpark, and the headroom is better than the A7 (of course), but also even the S90. The A6 can be had with the sweet turbo V6 from the S4 (which I also own), and the interior is phenomenal as you would expect. So...now I'm even more confused, LOL!
      2014 BMW 335i M-Sport/6MT
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    15. #13
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      Quote Originally Posted by GrecianVolvo View Post
      On the same token, you can find a low mileage S90 T8 Inscription, plug in Hybrid, AWD, low miles, Certified and for under $42K....great buy!
      Good point, that would address (maybe?) my powertrain issue with the car, but I insist on R-Design (rather than inscription), which was introduced only recently on the 2020 models.
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    16. #14
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      If rear legroom is a big priority then look at Audi A8L. If money was no object that's what I personally would get. Not many on the road so has more cache (IMO) than either S90 or BMW and has 43" or rear legroom... 2018's are in the mid $40's.
      2018 V90 T5 R Design FWD | Bursting Blue / Charcoal, Full Napa Leather | 20" R Design Diamond Cut wheels | Convenience Package | Laminated Glass | Heated Seats/Steering Wheel | HUD | Powered Load Cover | Mud Flaps | Rubber Floor Mats | Polestar Optimization

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      Quote Originally Posted by Iamhives View Post
      If rear legroom is a big priority then look at Audi A8L. If money was no object that's what I personally would get. Not many on the road so has more cache (IMO) than either S90 or BMW and has 43" or rear legroom... 2018's are in the mid $40's.
      I know this sounds like splitting hairs, but the A8/7-series, and especially the E class are just a bit too ostentatious for us. We actually looked at a used A8 when we bought the S90, and no doubt it was certainly a good deal (relatively speaking), but it was just over the top.


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    18. #16
      Junior Member choochjb's Avatar
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      So you want the styling of an R-Design, and you applaud the BMW for it's utility, thanks to being a hatchback. Why aren't you considering a V90 then? You could score a used V90 R-design for much less than the new S90.
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      Quote Originally Posted by choochjb View Post
      So you want the styling of an R-Design, and you applaud the BMW for it's utility, thanks to being a hatchback. Why aren't you considering a V90 then? You could score a used V90 R-design for much less than the new S90.
      I would LOVE a V90, but in 2018, as in now, it is NOT based on the long wheelbase like the S90, just the standard wheelbase. The 640i GT is essentially a fastback 5-series built on the longer wheelbase 7-series. Unfortunately, the V90 is not a paragon of rear seat legroom.


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      2014 BMW 335i M-Sport/6MT
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    20. #18
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      Quote Originally Posted by AudiA4 View Post
      I would LOVE a V90, but in 2018, as in now, it is NOT based on the long wheelbase like the S90, just the standard wheelbase. The 640i GT is essentially a fastback 5-series built on the longer wheelbase 7-series. Unfortunately, the V90 is not a paragon of rear seat legroom.


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      I have an S60 and V90. My 21 year old twins who are at least 6’2” tall easily fit in the back seat of the V90 without an issue. I would recommend that you bring your teen age boys for a long test drive when looking at the different cars to make sure they are comfortable. I started having my 3 boys in the car for test drives about 10 years ago and am glad I did. Otherwise, I might have bought a Chevy Cruze rather than my Ford Fusion Hybrid back in the day. We could barely get the rear doors shut with the three of them in the back seat.
      Last edited by rdr854; 06-30-2020 at 02:09 PM.
      Hers: 2019 S60 T5 R-Design FWD | Pebble Gray / Charcoal, Napa Leather | 18” R-Design Wheels | Heated Seats and Steering Wheel | Rubber Floor Mats

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      Former Volvos: 2018 V60 Dynamic, 2008 S80 3.2 (first one with adaptive cruise in US), 2006 XC90 V8, 2004 V70ASR, 2003 V70ASR (OSD and replaced by 04 due to tranny problem with valve body), 03 S80 T6 (OSD), 99 V70 and 98 V70 (twins wagons to match our new born twins), 96 850GTA wagon, 93 940 Wagon (Cloth, no sunoof), 92 240 and 90 240 DL.

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      I agree. My two teenage sons are over 6ft (as am I) and grew up with the space of a Honda Odyssey van, are perfectly happy driving from Northern Virginia to Florida in our V90.
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      Guys, the compounding issue on top of my 6’-2” boys is that I’m 6’-6”!!! LOL.


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    23. #21
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      Sounds like you need a Suburban. And yes, I have a current gen Suburban and it is very nice even though it is a base LT. All kidding aside, I think the first consideration is driver comfort with the second being whether your sons will be comfortable in the back seat with your seat all the way back. I’m 5’10” and bought a 2018 V60. Nice wagon, great deal. Comfortable to drive. Only problem, no room in the back seat. My fault because I did not check first. I love my V90 and am very happy with the room in the V90 since it is as almost as versatile as the Suburban for most things that I do or haul. That said, if your boys are close to college age, you might find the Suburban to be just the ticket because of the amount of stuff you will haul — especially if you find two in college at the same time.

      Another consideration is maintenance costs. I have heard antidotally that BMW is very expensive to service and repair.
      Hers: 2019 S60 T5 R-Design FWD | Pebble Gray / Charcoal, Napa Leather | 18” R-Design Wheels | Heated Seats and Steering Wheel | Rubber Floor Mats

      His: 2018 V90 T5 R-Design FWD | Crystal White / Charcoal, Full Napa Leather | 20" R-Design Diamond Cut Wheels | Convenience Package | Laminated Glass | Heated Seats/Steering Wheel | Powered Load Cover | Rubber Floor Mats | Integrated Child Safety Seats


      Former Volvos: 2018 V60 Dynamic, 2008 S80 3.2 (first one with adaptive cruise in US), 2006 XC90 V8, 2004 V70ASR, 2003 V70ASR (OSD and replaced by 04 due to tranny problem with valve body), 03 S80 T6 (OSD), 99 V70 and 98 V70 (twins wagons to match our new born twins), 96 850GTA wagon, 93 940 Wagon (Cloth, no sunoof), 92 240 and 90 240 DL.

    24. #22
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      Quote Originally Posted by rdr854 View Post
      Sounds like you need a Suburban. And yes, I have a current gen Suburban and it is very nice even though it is a base LT. All kidding aside, I think the first consideration is driver comfort with the second being whether your sons will be comfortable in the back seat with your seat all the way back. I’m 5’10” and bought a 2018 V60. Nice wagon, great deal. Comfortable to drive. Only problem, no room in the back seat. My fault because I did not check first. I love my V90 and am very happy with the room in the V90 since it is as almost as versatile as the Suburban for most things that I do or haul. That said, if your boys are close to college age, you might find the Suburban to be just the ticket because of the amount of stuff you will haul — especially if you find two in college at the same time.

      Another consideration is maintenance costs. I have heard antidotally that BMW is very expensive to service and repair.
      Have you ever sat in a 2018+ S90 on the LWB? The legroom is MILES more than the suburban. My father-in-law used to be a Chevrolet dealer; we used to own a Tahoe and he currently drives a new model Yukon. I suspect the current Tahoe/Yukon is comparable to the V90 (standard wheelbase), but the LWB S90 is in a different league. The BMW 640i GT is more comparable to the S90 than the V90.
      2014 BMW 335i M-Sport/6MT
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    25. #23
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      Quote Originally Posted by AudiA4 View Post
      Have you ever sat in a 2018+ S90 on the LWB? The legroom is MILES more than the suburban. My father-in-law used to be a Chevrolet dealer; we used to own a Tahoe and he currently drives a new model Yukon. I suspect the current Tahoe/Yukon is comparable to the V90 (standard wheelbase), but the LWB S90 is in a different league. The BMW 640i GT is more comparable to the S90 than the V90.
      No, I have not been in an S90. When I bought my V90, there was a $10K discount on the wagon as a left over and Volvo had a very small incentive for the 2018 S90 - so it was not considered. When I purchased the S60 to replace my Fusion two months ago, I realized that the S90 was too long to fit in the garage. As a result, it was not considered.

      As far as the Tahoe/Suburban, my understanding from Tahoe owners is that the Suburban/Yukon XL have more rear seat leg room than the Tahoe or Yukon and the current generation seems to have more room than my 2008 Suburban from back in the day.

      I was only trying to make suggestions for consideration. At the end of the day, it does not matter what works for me and my family. The bottom line is that irrespective of what anyone else thinks, you need to buy what makes you happy and what meets your needs. Aside from it being your money, it is you and your family that will be using the vehicle and have to be comfortable living with it.
      Hers: 2019 S60 T5 R-Design FWD | Pebble Gray / Charcoal, Napa Leather | 18” R-Design Wheels | Heated Seats and Steering Wheel | Rubber Floor Mats

      His: 2018 V90 T5 R-Design FWD | Crystal White / Charcoal, Full Napa Leather | 20" R-Design Diamond Cut Wheels | Convenience Package | Laminated Glass | Heated Seats/Steering Wheel | Powered Load Cover | Rubber Floor Mats | Integrated Child Safety Seats


      Former Volvos: 2018 V60 Dynamic, 2008 S80 3.2 (first one with adaptive cruise in US), 2006 XC90 V8, 2004 V70ASR, 2003 V70ASR (OSD and replaced by 04 due to tranny problem with valve body), 03 S80 T6 (OSD), 99 V70 and 98 V70 (twins wagons to match our new born twins), 96 850GTA wagon, 93 940 Wagon (Cloth, no sunoof), 92 240 and 90 240 DL.

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      Quote Originally Posted by rdr854 View Post
      I was only trying to make suggestions for consideration. At the end of the day, it does not matter what works for me and my family. The bottom line is that irrespective of what anyone else thinks, you need to buy what makes you happy and what meets your needs. Aside from it being your money, it is you and your family that will be using the vehicle and have to be comfortable living with it.
      Just to be clear, I wasn't asking in a sarcastic way, I was just seriously curious if you'd ever sat in the LWB S90 because almost nothing compares short of an A8L or 740/50iL. It's pretty crazy. Even though I'm the one who's 6'-6", it's my wife who's become addicted to the interior size. I'm not a truck/SUV guy (as far as a daily driver), so if it were completely up to me, I'd rather compromise and get something that was workable (mid-sized) and something with a V6. The 640i GT is really the only outlier that meets those criteria while retaining the legroom. Who knows...I may circle back to the S90. I love the new R-Design package that's available...I just can't decide if I can continue to live with the T6 engine.
      2014 BMW 335i M-Sport/6MT
      2014 Volvo XC60 R-Design
      2018 Audi S4
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      Quote Originally Posted by AudiA4 View Post
      Just to be clear, I wasn't asking in a sarcastic way, I was just seriously curious if you'd ever sat in the LWB S90 because almost nothing compares short of an A8L or 740/50iL. It's pretty crazy. Even though I'm the one who's 6'-6", it's my wife who's become addicted to the interior size. I'm not a truck/SUV guy (as far as a daily driver), so if it were completely up to me, I'd rather compromise and get something that was workable (mid-sized) and something with a V6. The 640i GT is really the only outlier that meets those criteria while retaining the legroom. Who knows...I may circle back to the S90. I love the new R-Design package that's available...I just can't decide if I can continue to live with the T6 engine.
      I did not think you were. I just wanted to be clear that I recognize and respect that it is your choice, just like the T5 is my choice for a variety of reasons (even though I have driven the T6 as a service loaner).
      Hers: 2019 S60 T5 R-Design FWD | Pebble Gray / Charcoal, Napa Leather | 18” R-Design Wheels | Heated Seats and Steering Wheel | Rubber Floor Mats

      His: 2018 V90 T5 R-Design FWD | Crystal White / Charcoal, Full Napa Leather | 20" R-Design Diamond Cut Wheels | Convenience Package | Laminated Glass | Heated Seats/Steering Wheel | Powered Load Cover | Rubber Floor Mats | Integrated Child Safety Seats


      Former Volvos: 2018 V60 Dynamic, 2008 S80 3.2 (first one with adaptive cruise in US), 2006 XC90 V8, 2004 V70ASR, 2003 V70ASR (OSD and replaced by 04 due to tranny problem with valve body), 03 S80 T6 (OSD), 99 V70 and 98 V70 (twins wagons to match our new born twins), 96 850GTA wagon, 93 940 Wagon (Cloth, no sunoof), 92 240 and 90 240 DL.

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      Quote Originally Posted by rdr854 View Post
      I did not think you were. I just wanted to be clear that I recognize and respect that it is your choice, just like the T5 is my choice for a variety of reasons (even though I have driven the T6 as a service loaner).
      You'll get no criticism from me regarding your choice of the T5...by default I went with the T6 in our 2018 S90, and having had a T5 loaner, I may even like it better. Strangely, it feels quicker (maybe the kick after a slight lag), and more importantly, it SOUNDS better! A supercharger may sound cool with a V8, but it absolutely does not compliment a 4-cylinder; it just reinforces the sewing machine acoustics of the T6. Sigh.
      2014 BMW 335i M-Sport/6MT
      2014 Volvo XC60 R-Design
      2018 Audi S4
      2020 Volvo S90 R-Design/Polestar

    29. #27
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      I had a CPO 2018 V90 CC T6 that was totaled by a state highway truck. I needed to find a replacement quickly, and bought a CPO 2019 V90 CC T5. I too think it drives better than the T6. The engine and transmission seem better matched, although that might be due to the March 2020 software update. The only time I really feel the difference is when passing, and then only at times because I rarely floor it.

    30. #28
      Member Magic Marker's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by GrecianVolvo View Post
      On the same token, you can find a low mileage S90 T8 Inscription, plug in Hybrid, AWD, low miles, Certified and for under $42K....great buy!
      Wow.. that's pretty crazy
      2019 XC40 RD P* & 2013 XC60 T6 P* / 2011 S60 T6 (Traded In)

    31. #29
      Junior Member mattlach's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by bogus7430 View Post
      I would get it just for the B&O system. I have had my fair share of prestige marquees with upgraded sound systems ( Meridian, Naim, HK, Burmese high end 3D surround eyc..) and this B&O system in the recently purchased V90 CC is just outstanding. Only the mercs Burmester comes close or on par( the merc system has more configurability).

      Sent from my SM-N976B using Tapatalk
      They switched to B&O now? I thought it was B&W?

      I might be a little jealous in that case because I hate the sound in my 2017 S90, and I hated the B&W system of the rental S90 I drove in Sweden.

      The sound is forward, bright and piercing. You can even turn it up and enjoy it loud without it causing pain.

      Easily the worst sound system I have had in any car in the last 20 years. It's the part I dislike the most about my S90.

    32. #30
      Junior Member mattlach's Avatar
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      It's funny.

      OP is the first person I've ever heard speak positively of the 2018+ long wheel base S90.

      Everyone else I've spoken to (myself included) bemoan the fact that the car got too big in 2018 and wish we still got the shorter version they sell in Europe.

      I spent a lot of time looking for a super low mile certified 2017 for this reason. I would have bought a newer one, but I didn't like the longer wheel base.

    33. #31
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      B&W is still listed as the premium ($3200) sound system for the S90. B&O's are found in Audi, and I think Bentleys.

    34. #32
      Junior Member Ultrarunner511's Avatar
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      Quote Originally Posted by mattlach View Post
      It's funny.

      OP is the first person I've ever heard speak positively of the 2018+ long wheel base S90.

      Everyone else I've spoken to (myself included) bemoan the fact that the car got too big in 2018 and wish we still got the shorter version they sell in Europe.

      I spent a lot of time looking for a super low mile certified 2017 for this reason. I would have bought a newer one, but I didn't like the longer wheel base.
      Those rear seats though.......big long stretch....

    35. #33
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      Quote Originally Posted by Ultrarunner511 View Post
      Those rear seats though.......big long stretch....
      Exactly this...I'm 6'-6", and I've never been in a car until the LWB S90 that I could actually set the seat where I wanted it without any worry about passengers behind me. I can understand - aesthetically - why someone would prefer the 2017 regular wheelbase, but honestly, I think for a stretch sedan, the S90 pulls it off about as well as any I've seen - that and the Lincoln Continental Coach edition (RIP).
      2014 BMW 335i M-Sport/6MT
      2014 Volvo XC60 R-Design
      2018 Audi S4
      2020 Volvo S90 R-Design/Polestar

    36. #34
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      Quote Originally Posted by AudiA4 View Post
      Exactly this...I'm 6'-6", and I've never been in a car until the LWB S90 that I could actually set the seat where I wanted it without any worry about passengers behind me. I can understand - aesthetically - why someone would prefer the 2017 regular wheelbase, but honestly, I think for a stretch sedan, the S90 pulls it off about as well as any I've seen - that and the Lincoln Continental Coach edition (RIP).
      For me it was about whether it would fit in the garage. The LWB is just too long do work. No room to get in the house from the garage. An New SWB may have been just the ticket, but since it is not available, our S60 does quite well for our needs and was priced very well.
      Hers: 2019 S60 T5 R-Design FWD | Pebble Gray / Charcoal, Napa Leather | 18” R-Design Wheels | Heated Seats and Steering Wheel | Rubber Floor Mats

      His: 2018 V90 T5 R-Design FWD | Crystal White / Charcoal, Full Napa Leather | 20" R-Design Diamond Cut Wheels | Convenience Package | Laminated Glass | Heated Seats/Steering Wheel | Powered Load Cover | Rubber Floor Mats | Integrated Child Safety Seats


      Former Volvos: 2018 V60 Dynamic, 2008 S80 3.2 (first one with adaptive cruise in US), 2006 XC90 V8, 2004 V70ASR, 2003 V70ASR (OSD and replaced by 04 due to tranny problem with valve body), 03 S80 T6 (OSD), 99 V70 and 98 V70 (twins wagons to match our new born twins), 96 850GTA wagon, 93 940 Wagon (Cloth, no sunoof), 92 240 and 90 240 DL.

    37. #35
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      Quote Originally Posted by AudiA4 View Post
      All - input appreciated on new vehicle options:

      We currently drive a 2018 S90 Momentum (Silver/Amber) and our lease is about to expire. We chose this car partly because of our great experience with our 2014 XC60 R-Design (LOVE that car and engine...fun and very reliable, now with 100,000 miles) but MOSTLY because of the massive rear legroom. We have a tall family with two large, late teenage boys. We love sedans and there aren't many options that are truly long wheelbase (LWB) in the U.S.D.M. Even the Lincoln and Cadillac large sedan offerings don't offer this level of legroom. When we selected the car, I was EXTREMELY aggravated that Volvo didn't offer the R-Design trim in the U.S., so though we really like the utility and general aesthetics of the car, we've never really loved it. In particular, I really despise the T6 powertrain...this is a great sedan in search of an equally great 6 or 8 cylinder engine.

      So, choices for 2020...

      2018 BMW 640i Gran Turismo
      So when looking for any and all LWB options for 2020, which are still slim, I remembered the quirky 2018-2019 BMW 640i Gran Turismo (it was discontinued in the U.S. market after 2019, but continues on worldwide - a refresh for the 2021 model was just unveiled). It is the replacement for the seriously awkward previous 5 series GT, but now rebranded as a 6-series and completely redesigned. It's essentially the 540i sedan mechanicals built on a 7-series platform, so it also has a HUGE amount of rear legroom. It is one of BMW's strange in-between, niche market cars: it's long wheelbase, but in a hatchback/fastback profile that some find awkward, but I find quite appealing. It adds a lot of utility without being a wagon or SAV or SUV. So, my thoughts:

      Pros: more power/quicker, phenomenal engine (BMW's silky, powerful B58 incline 6 cylinder), hatchback utility, large backseat, luxury interior (less restrained Volvo and more extrovert BMW), probably more rare than even the elusive S90, in some ways more sporty/adventurous than the S90 (i.e. it's well suited to just throw my bike in the back hatch), wireless charging and wireless Apple CarPlay, less expensive (about $42K in the market with the options I'm looking for), Certified warranty
      Cons: used only - though Certified (only made two model years in the U.S.), not as attractive as the S90, interior is luxurious - but in many ways dated compared to the Swedish interior (but then again, whose isn't!)

      2020 Volvo S90 R-Design
      We initially had NO desire to get another S90, partly because we just wanted to try something different, and perhaps mostly since the S90 remains completely unchanged since 2018. However, our local dealer has the EXACT car I wanted in 2018...white, R-Design, slick black interior with contrast stitching, along with options we don't currently have (B&O, HUD, etc), and they're offering it for essentially the exact same lease as our current 2018 even though it has a lot more equipment...so in essence, though I'm not super excited about getting the same car again, the 2020 models, and this one in particular now ADD all of the things that were missing in our 2018 model that had left us wanting....

      Pros: new car, R-Design now available, beautiful exterior (not a better looking sedan on the road), stunning interior
      Cons: not sure I want to drive the same car again, more expensive than the BMW ($56K), still terrible T6 power plant, less utility as a sedan vs. hatchback

      So I'm torn...the S90 is objectively the better choice, and is now what I always wanted it to be, but I feel compelled to try something different. Thoughts?
      By coincidence, the 640i GT was at the top of my short list ahead of the V90 (at that time hadn't decided between the V90 and V90 CC). I had found a low mileage 640i GT demo with the spec I wanted at a good price in Montreal, fully loaded, including the rear wheel steering and adaptive suspension. The holdup was the possibility of getting a hitch. I had corresponded with Stealth and they were uncharacteristically slow in response - finally saying maybe - then clarifying that they had actually done one for a customer but it had to have the "M-Sports" package (which is how they are sold in Canada anyway). By the time I got my answer, I missed it by a couple days. If you can get past the odd looks of the 640i GT it is a really good car - more comparable to the V90CC than an S90. It has more cargo capacity than the V90 and the rear seats are much more spacious (and doors are bigger). With the rear seats down - it is huge - more than a MB E-class wagon. Even ground clearance was not bad with the suspension raised.

      I test drove a couple in Toronto that didn't quite match the spec I wanted and was very impressed. The B58 engine is a great match for the car - it handles really well (for its size) and was definitely fun to drive. The engine is fantastic, as you noted. The cliche "turbine like power delivery" is often over-used - but entirely appropriate here.

      Long story short - while waiting for another opportunity for another low mileage loaded 640i GT to come up, I saw my V90 CC which had almost everything I wanted (T6, B&W, premium package, heated/ventilated/massage seats in amber, even a second set of wheels with snows) at a great price - so ended up grabbing it quickly. The other rationalization was future service - the Volvo came with the 6 year/160 km extended coverage and was a 2019 vs 2018 for the BMW with 4 year/80k kms. I knew from past ownership of a couple of 3 series that dealer service at BMW can get pretty pricey and my last car (MB) had a horrendous service record - saved by my extended warranty. So decided to give Volvo a try.

      If you DO choose the Volvo - include the Polestar Optimization in your comparison - still no B58, but closes the gap a little.

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