To Camber or not to Camber
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    1. #1
      Junior Member
      Join Date
      May 2020
      Posts
      16

      To Camber or not to Camber

      So many of you probably don't know me. I've been lurking for 3 years now since I got my first s60, and last year I picked up my S60R and have been visiting the forums on a daily. You guys have been a great help, and most of my questions never need to get posted because #SearchBar

      I have been on the fence for the last 2 months about this and still haven't decided what I want to do. Heres my specs to give you a better idea about my R's setup.

      04 M66
      18' Pegs on Michelin pilot sport A/S 3 (One of my favorite tires to date)
      Powerflex Bushings All Around
      V70R Front & Rear Track Spec Sways
      IPD Adjustable Toe Rods
      IPD Front End Links
      IPD Rear End Links
      Snabb Turbo intake Pipe
      Eiback Rear springs on 4C Struts
      Custom 3' exhaust with Y Cutout Dump Pipe

      Car is mainly used for Track and is a cruise / night car. I daily it somedays but usually put the kms on my SUV.

      2 months ago I installed most of the aftermarket stuff in one go. I jacked her up on the driveway and she sat 3 tires high. I must have been a lot higher than that to think that would be enough for me to comfortable change the rear / front sway bar, toe rods, and do all the bushings. Fast forward 3 weeks and a lot of swearing and I finished the job. Then I remembered I got a set of eiback's for the rear when I bought the car so I ordered a new set of 4c Struts and threw them on. I cannot explain the hate I have for the Passenger side 4c clip. After it was all done I figured I'd sell my Contis SportContacts and get some new rubber. A buddy of mine owns a Green and Ross (A shop in the good Ole Canaduh that specializes in tires) and gave me a kick ass deal on my A/S 3's and found a buyer for my contis at the same time haha.

      Since I lowered the back and put on the new tires my alignment tech (who also a really good friend of mine and builds 600+hp Honda's) has been nagging me to get the camber bushings since my camber is -2.5. He doesn't want to see me destroy the tires, and he said my handling will probably improve. I see this guy 3-4 times a week at night and hes not looking to make himself extra cash. He actually helped me put on my front sway bar at the shop because it was just that much easier with a hoist, than on tire stands (if thats even a word). So he knows hes going to end up getting stuck doing it for free The only thing I literally pay him to do is alignments. I do tip with Beer, Pizza and Weed when he helps me out, so it's a pretty fair trade

      I have been reading a lot on the forums as I said and it seems to me that

      1. The negative camber will not wear the tires, its mainly the toe that will wear the tires weird.
      2. As long as I rotate the tires every 5k (which is my oil change basically) I will be ok.

      I have not experienced side hop at (Pretty sure it's because of the poly bushings) and don't really have any visible weird tire wear.

      I saw Viva sells a kit that does both the toe and camber similar to the kit from IPD
      Viva Kit : https://www.vivaperformance.com/rear...-s80-xc90-awd/
      IPD Kit: https://www.ipdusa.com/products/1025...kit-ipd-121638

      I was contemplating on buying the IPD Camber bushings, but today I was reading a post in this thread and someone used these Bushings : Focus, Volvo C30 / S40 / V50, Mazda3 Rear Upper Control Arm Camber Adjustable Bushing.

      Now I'm not a rich guy, but I don't mind spending money on this car because I've already decided I will be keeping it forever. I have a whole parts car that I've already taken apart and the parts are in my storage. I'm also in the process of building a Frankenstein block with a 2.3 bottom end and the heads from a R. The block on the car right now has already been shimmed and is on a tune, but thats for another thread.

      Now that you have a little bit of background...

      My question is, If i plan to daily this is the summer, should I get the camber bushings and bite the bullet? I don't want to experience side hop and I love the way my handling feels right now. I mean I did spend $80 on the poly bushings, but like I said, I'm willing to spend the extra money. I already have the old bushings out, which is pretty much the hardest part of the job in my opinion.
      I also don't mind the fact that the wheels are cambered in a little. I know some people can't stand it, but my car was built to be track focused not to be aesthetically pleasing (although I love the look of the R's).

      For those of you who think I should get camber bushings should I go with IPD, the kit from Viva, (I'm sure Connor would sell the bushing separate from the kit) or the poly kit from Powerflex. I know the guy that posted about the Poly bushings is active so I hope he answers this posts, if not I'm going to pm him.

      Other than that I'm open to suggestions. I have thought about repositioning the struts hole in the knuckle but I want to save that as a last resort thing. I don't know if theres a difference between the one in he R and the one in the s60 so I don't want to go drilling into something i may not find another of. I do have a set of spares, but would rather keep those for emergency use and not for test purposes.

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    3. #2
      Junior Member
      Join Date
      Mar 2013
      Location
      Arizona
      Posts
      803
      Quote Originally Posted by Matt_Robz View Post
      1. The negative camber will not wear the tires, its mainly the toe that will wear the tires weird.
      I'm not sure I agree with that. I had 2 sets of tires wear excessively on the inside shoulder. The first set was the factory tires and the toe was still spot on at factory specs with 23,000 miles on the odometer.
      This is the second set from 2010. These were rotated every 5k or so.

      P6300266.jpg

      P6270254.jpg
      2006 V70R MT
      Sonic Blue / Gobi
      Original owner

    4. #3
      Junior Member Rodtheviking's Avatar
      Join Date
      Jun 2019
      Location
      Vancouver, WA
      Posts
      224
      I also have the Eibach springs and I am at -2deg on both sides. I don't drive my car all that much but getting the rear back to spec for me is important. I was going to order the Focus Powerflex but decided that adjust-ability isn't really an issue, once that are set I don't ever need to mess with them.
      I will stick with the IPD ones, set it and forget it.

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    6. #4
      Junior Member
      Join Date
      Aug 2013
      Posts
      23
      I also went with ipd. Set it (after swearing and throwing wrenches) and forget it. I didn't bother measuring the camber before install as it looked like I had a lot to begin with ipd lowering springs. Happy with the results.


    7. #5
      Member maronha's Avatar
      Join Date
      Mar 2008
      Location
      WV
      Posts
      2,064
      Quote Originally Posted by Phoenix R View Post
      I'm not sure I agree with that. I had 2 sets of tires wear excessively on the inside shoulder. The first set was the factory tires and the toe was still spot on at factory specs with 23,000 miles on the odometer.
      This is the second set from 2010. These were rotated every 5k or so.

      P6300266.jpg

      P6270254.jpg
      I agree the IPD camber bushing solved my tire wear problems. Before my tires looked just like your and worse.
      2006 Sonic V70R GT 152k
      2013 XC90 R Design Electric Silver 53K (The Wife's)
      2015 Silverado High Country 1500 4WD Ruby Metallic 82k

    8. #6
      Member Body Massage's Avatar
      Join Date
      Aug 2008
      Location
      Bellingham, MA
      Posts
      3,584
      Quote Originally Posted by Phoenix R View Post
      I'm not sure I agree with that. I had 2 sets of tires wear excessively on the inside shoulder. The first set was the factory tires and the toe was still spot on at factory specs with 23,000 miles on the odometer.
      This is the second set from 2010. These were rotated every 5k or so.

      What's factory toe, though? I had my toe set to 0, both sides. I haven't run into uneven wear, and still have ~ 2 degree negative camber.
      2005 V70R

      2010 C30 R-Design

    9. #7
      Junior Member
      Join Date
      May 2020
      Posts
      16
      [QUOTE=Phoenix R;7609153]I'm not sure I agree with that. I had 2 sets of tires wear excessively on the inside shoulder. The first set was the factory tires and the toe was still spot on at factory specs with 23,000 miles on the odometer.
      This is the second set from 2010. These were rotated every 5k or so.
      I plan on rotating my tires every 5k. The first pic with factory tires is pretty bad wear, The second set is less noticeable but still there. I usually sell my tires once i get down to 40% tread. I just dont want it to be super noticeable when im selling them.

      Quote Originally Posted by Body Massage View Post
      What's factory toe, though? I had my toe set to 0, both sides. I haven't run into uneven wear, and still have ~ 2 degree negative camber.
      This is why im so torn. Your not the first person to say that. Theres also a guy in my city who runs a lowered R that told me the same thing. I also have seen his tires wear over the year. Unless hes changing tires or taking the tire off the rim and flipping them around.

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