Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit
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    1. #1
      Member 24Hours's Avatar
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      Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit

      This made the front page of the WSJ, but since most folks won't have full online access, I'll link to the Washington Post's reporting:

      Bernanke Renews Debt Warning

      Excerpt:

      Quote, originally posted by Washington Post »
      Federal Reserve Chairman Ben S. Bernanke warned Congress yesterday of a "fiscal crisis" if it doesn't curb the projected growth of federal spending on retirement and health-care programs.

      Echoing similar warnings by his predecessor, Alan Greenspan, Bernanke told the Senate Budget Committee that "the effects on the U.S. economy would be severe" if the government's debt were allowed to balloon as forecast.

      Bernanke noted that the federal deficit has declined in the past two years but said that was "the calm before the storm" of skyrocketing expenses for an aging population. He cited Congressional Budget Office projections that spending on the big entitlement programs -- Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid -- will equal 15 percent of the nation's gross domestic product by 2030, double last year's level.

      Bernanke, who was a top White House economic adviser until last year, declined to take a position on whether to extend President Bush's tax cuts, many of which are set to expire by 2010. He said he would be nonpartisan as Fed chairman, offering general economic analysis but no specific recommendations on taxes or spending.

      The "difficult choices" of how to balance the government's spending and revenue should be made by Congress, the White House and the public, he said.

      The federal deficit fell last year to $248 billion, 1.9 percent of the nation's total economic output, by one commonly cited measure. But the deficit would have been $434 billion, or 3.3 percent of gross domestic product, if the government hadn't borrowed from Social Security, Bernanke said.

      He also decried "burdensome" tax rules and said Congress might raise tax receipts by making them simpler.

      Given the tradition of the Fed Chairman to remain politically neutral and the fact that Bush appointed Ben B (also former advisor to Bush), I think this speaks volumes about the hazards of the fiscal policy currently employed by the Bush admin.

      I can't wait for the State of the, the state of the country, state, whatever you call it! Set the Tivo for Tuesday.

      Bush doesn't know what to call it either (CLICK TO LISTEN )

      Beware the siren that sells-out our future for the sake of lower corporate taxes.

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    3. #2
      Senior Member 2k2S80t6's Avatar
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      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit (24Hours)

      Well, it's an easy fix. the Dems with win the white house in 2008. With control of the legislative and executive branches they will run wild raising taxes to never before seen levels to fund a debt pay down (so they can say they fixed our problems) and socialized healthcare and other welfare programs. We will look more an more like Canada every day. Our military will be emasculated as well.

    4. #3
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      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit (2k2S80t6)

      Quote, originally posted by 2k2S80t6 »
      Well, it's an easy fix. the Dems with win the white house in 2008. With control of the legislative and executive branches they will run wild raising taxes to never before seen levels to fund a debt pay down (so they can say they fixed our problems) and socialized healthcare and other welfare programs. We will look more an more like Canada every day. Our military will be emasculated as well.

      If you were running the show, what would you propose to manage spending and pay down some debt? Seriously.

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    6. #4
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      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit (MrTippy)

      Quote, originally posted by MrTippy »
      If you were running the show, what would you propose to manage spending and pay down some debt? Seriously.

      He would propose exactly what we had for the past 5 years; A GOP controlled everything that subscribes to trickle down economics to solve the deficit....but keeps on spending.

      Remember, Dumbya says that he'll cut the deficit in half by 2008 and hope to eliminate it by 2012. All we have to do is make his tax cuts permanent.

      Quote, originally posted by 2k2S80t6 »
      Well, it's an easy fix. the Dems with win the white house in 2008. With control of the legislative and executive branches they will run wild raising taxes to never before seen levels to fund a debt pay down (so they can say they fixed our problems) and socialized healthcare and other welfare programs. We will look more an more like Canada every day. Our military will be emasculated as well.

      Glad to see that you can quote the GOP handbook. Isn't that the same one that claims that the GOP is supposed to be fiscally conservative? Where have they been for the past five years?

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    7. #5
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      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit (2k2S80t6)

      Quote, originally posted by 2k2S80t6 »
      Well, it's an easy fix. the Dems with win the white house in 2008. With control of the legislative and executive branches they will run wild raising taxes to never before seen levels to fund a debt pay down (so they can say they fixed our problems) and socialized healthcare and other welfare programs. We will look more an more like Canada every day. Our military will be emasculated as well.

      Jeez, man. "Okay, you've got control, let's see you fix it! Nya, nya nya."

      Are we not all in this same little boat together? Is there not a "problem" to be fixed?

      Reduced to their most simple definitions, the GOP is for Big Business, Small Government and lassez faire economics. The Dems are for social and welfare programs, government oversight and a controlled economy. I guess those two models are mutually exclusive. I never have figured out how you could cut taxes and fund anything, including a war. Add to the mix the personality of the contemporary leader of the Excutive Branch, and whether or not that individual is of the same party in the White House, and you get a pretty interesting goulash.

      Neither side will have all the answers, ever. I suppose if I just got my butt kicked outa town I might be a bit testy, too. I keep watchin' this drama play out until the next round of elections. For today, I am bone-tired of all the partisanship. It sucks, its counterproductive and adds nothing of consequence to the ongoing struggle. I've done my damage for today.

      No smiley for this crap.


    8. #6

      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit (Steely)

      People are so freaking stupid. Here we had a chance to let the GOP roll on and continue fixing things, as they have been doing so well, and the idiot American voters come along and screw everything up by handing control of Congress to the Dems, for Pete's sake! People really are stupd. Guess we'll just have to wait and see what happens.
      Let's see: If I reduced my income by giving breaks to customer's that were my buddies, ya know, high rollers, but I had a "war" goin' against some guy across town that's suckin' up tons o' cash, I guess I could just not pay my insurance and blame the whole thing on my wife's family

      Well, so much for non-partisan

      Simply put, the Democrats and Republicans have very different views on economics.
      What doesn't help is the the voters agree with both of them.
      Up until now, neither party has had the cojones to tackel the problem. Bush's attempt got smacked down, like everyone knew it would.
      Every Administration AND Congress since LBJ's time has known what the math is in regards to SS.
      None of them have tackled the problem.
      I'd be willing to bet that the problem won't be addressed in 2008 either.

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    9. #7

      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit (VolvoMax)

      I don't know for sure, but I always thought conservatives wanted low taxes, low spending, and a small government... I know that's what I like.

      Right now we have moderate taxes (could be lower), high spending (mostly due to war), and one porked up, fat government.


    10. #8
      Senior Member R Kelly's Avatar
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      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit (KMK454)

      Quote, originally posted by KMK454 »
      high spending (mostly due to war)

      Actually no. The high spending is due to Republican "earmarks", where individuals can set aside money for pet projects secretly while funding bill is in committee, so no one will know who did it. Remember the bridge to nowhere in Alaska?

      Don't count the war spending, the Republicans have been on a pork spending spree since 2000 that has been greater than ANY democratic one in history.

      Now, add the Bush's war spending (e.g. Haliburton subsidizing) on top of that, and post something stupid about tax cuts....every republican starting with the president should have their pay garnished until debt is paid off. And guess what people, we are going to have to pay our bills, it wasn't our surplus, you can't have a surplus is you have 3 trillion in debt you are paying interest on. Now we have 8 trillion in debt we are paying interest on. You know how many BILLIONS in interest are being wasted every year???

      Pay off the debt, stop paying all that interest, AND then we deserve a tax cut. Although, the people I voted for actually decreased the national debt from 1994 on and were fiscally conservative, so I think that only the people that voted Republican and for Bush should have to pay for their irresponsibility.

      What an idea, only the people that voted for the politicians that spend out of control have to pay the extra taxes. Bet people pay attention then...

      Wish we had a balanced budget amendment to protect our children...


    11. #9
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      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit ("R" Kelly)

      So what would happen if there was no income tax? Would the government fail? Nope, at least the one that ran w/o revenues from personal income tax revenues from the Revolutionary War to 1913 ran fine.

      The primary use of funds is to redistribute wealth, which is social programs. The elderly are sucking the country's resources at an astonishing rate. And it makes no sense to burden the young with the problems of the nearly-dead.

      Coastal Eskimos used to shove grandma and grandpa out to sea on an iceberg. That's tough love.

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    12. #10
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      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit (VolvoMax)

      Quote, originally posted by VolvoMax »
      People are so freaking stupid. Here we had a chance to let the GOP roll on and continue fixing things, as they have been doing so well, and the idiot American voters come along and screw everything up by handing control of Congress to the Dems, for Pete's sake! People really are stupd. Guess we'll just have to wait and see what happens.
      Let's see: If I reduced my income by giving breaks to customer's that were my buddies, ya know, high rollers, but I had a "war" goin' against some guy across town that's suckin' up tons o' cash, I guess I could just not pay my insurance and blame the whole thing on my wife's family

      Well, so much for non-partisan

      Simply put, the Democrats and Republicans have very different views on economics.
      What doesn't help is the the voters agree with both of them.
      Up until now, neither party has had the cojones to tackel the problem. Bush's attempt got smacked down, like everyone knew it would.
      Every Administration AND Congress since LBJ's time has known what the math is in regards to SS.
      None of them have tackled the problem.
      I'd be willing to bet that the problem won't be addressed in 2008 either.

      Max,

      You are cutting and pasting my remarks from one topic to another. Flattering, I guess. Please try to remain within the context of each topic and allow my ironic comments to do the same. Thanks.


    13. #11
      Senior Member 2k2S80t6's Avatar
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      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit (24Hours)

      Quote, originally posted by 24Hours »
      So what would happen if there was no income tax? Would the government fail? Nope, at least the one that ran w/o revenues from personal income tax revenues from the Revolutionary War to 1913 ran fine.

      The primary use of funds is to redistribute wealth, which is social programs. The elderly are sucking the country's resources at an astonishing rate. And it makes no sense to burden the young with the problems of the nearly-dead...


      I disagree. Besides being a selfish POV, it is a flawed argument. Without the labors of the now elderly, what would exist for the 'young' to work with? As much as we need to prepare our young for being the next generation of leaders and such, we should care for our elders, as they laid the path for us.
      That said, bear in mind I am against many social programs, but cutting of our elders is not one of them. Welfare and other abused social programs are much more of an issue to me and a burden on our society. Why not address the crack ***** mother of 5 instead of cutting off the prescriptions for grandmother?


    14. #12
      Senior Member R Kelly's Avatar
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      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit (2k2S80t6)

      My least favorite welfare program is farm subsidies.

      Funny, republicans don't seem to mind this welfare, but they sure mind the welfare going to poor mothers...


      Modified by "R" Kelly at 9:06 PM 1-21-2007


    15. #13
      Senior Member 2k2S80t6's Avatar
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      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit ("R" Kelly)

      It's not just poor mothers, it is the ones abusing the system. I am not a big proponent of the farm subsidies either. Especially when we are paying a farmer to not use his land for what it is meant for. I grew up (high school/college) in a farm town of hard working corn/dairy farmers. The subsidies they see are far different from that of the Maryland Tobacco farmers, for example. Like anything, there is good and bad and you can't really be black and white on any specific issue.

    16. #14

      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit (Steely)

      Quote, originally posted by Steely »

      Max,

      You are cutting and pasting my remarks from one topic to another. Flattering, I guess. Please try to remain within the context of each topic and allow my ironic comments to do the same. Thanks.

      So, one can have entirely different sentiments about the same thing if it is in different topics?
      Cool!

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    17. #15

      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit ("R" Kelly)

      Quote, originally posted by "R" Kelly »
      My least favorite welfare program is farm subsidies.

      Funny, republicans don't seem to mind this welfare, but they sure mind the welfare going to poor mothers...


      Modified by "R" Kelly at 9:06 PM 1-21-2007

      Farmers have $$ and vote.
      Poor mothers have neither

      Actually, I thought that the democrats were the friend of the farmer.
      Willie Nelson and the Farm Aid crew are always bashing Republicans.

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      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit (2k2S80t6)

      Quote, originally posted by 2k2S80t6 »
      . Like anything, there is good and bad and you can't really be black and white on any specific issue.

      Careful, you're gonna get kicked out of your party

      ;-)

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    19. #17
      I suppose ifn the people of this mixed up country can get legislation passed that will force the congress and senate a huge paycut in their salaries and seven figure retirement we could use that money for social security.

      That + cut the pork out of every Democrat and Republicans agendas we could force the gvt to balance the budget with out tax hike and such.


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      Re: (DVolvoguy777)

      Quote, originally posted by DVolvoguy777 »
      I suppose ifn the people of this mixed up country can get legislation passed that will force the congress and senate a huge paycut in their salaries and seven figure retirement we could use that money for social security.

      That + cut the pork out of every Democrat and Republicans agendas we could force the gvt to balance the budget with out tax hike and such.

      all good ideas

      and maybe we can start taxing those BS Church organizations that don't do any charity work but do all sorts of political stuff.

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    21. #19

      Re: (DVolvoguy777)

      Quote, originally posted by DVolvoguy777 »
      I suppose ifn the people of this mixed up country can get legislation passed that will force the congress and senate a huge paycut in their salaries and seven figure retirement we could use that money for social security.

      That + cut the pork out of every Democrat and Republicans agendas we could force the gvt to balance the budget with out tax hike and such.

      Only problem is the voters LIKE their pork.
      WE send mixed messages to Congress.
      We want them to cut spending, as long as it doesn't affect us.
      As an example, look at the mess when the Pentagon wants to close a base.
      These are cash cows for their communities, so the local pols and the people band together to keep the base open if possible.
      Yet, people want to cut defense spending

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    22. #20
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      Re: (VolvoMax)

      Quote, originally posted by VolvoMax »

      Only problem is the voters LIKE their pork.
      WE send mixed messages to Congress.
      We want them to cut spending, as long as it doesn't affect us.
      As an example, look at the mess when the Pentagon wants to close a base.
      These are cash cows for their communities, so the local pols and the people band together to keep the base open if possible.
      Yet, people want to cut defense spending

      And they want lower taxes along with more services and a higher standard of living.


    23. #21

      Re: (Steely)

      Quote, originally posted by Steely »

      And they want lower taxes along with more services and a higher standard of living.

      yup, now you get the picture.

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      Senior Member 2k2S80t6's Avatar
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      Re: (ADP1)

      +1 Million

    25. #23
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      Re: (VolvoMax)

      Quote, originally posted by VolvoMax »

      yup, now you get the picture.

      I've understood the concept of "You get what you pay for" ever since they ran that coffee commercial about John Arbuckle.

      I've seen the before-and-after of life in California under Prop. 13. I believe in paying taxes in return for services received.

      I personally would pay upwards of 50% of my income in taxes if it would raise the standard of living in the US to that of, say...Norway, Sweden or Switzerland.


    26. #24

      Re: (Steely)

      Quote, originally posted by Steely »

      I've understood the concept of "You get what you pay for" ever since they ran that coffee commercial about John Arbuckle.

      I've seen the before-and-after of life in California under Prop. 13. I believe in paying taxes in return for services received.

      I personally would pay upwards of 50% of my income in taxes if it would raise the standard of living in the US to that of, say...Norway, Sweden or Switzerland.

      I wouldn't, I've been to Sweden.

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    27. #25
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      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit (VolvoMax)

      Quote, originally posted by VolvoMax »

      So, one can have entirely different sentiments about the same thing if it is in different topics?
      Cool!

      Max,

      What is important is that you screw with the chronology of my responses. After participation in three topics, all rife with polarized attitudes, including my own, and being physically sick, which is none of your business, I got tired of the sturm und drang.

      C,mon, Max, you're usually more about the facts and less about personalities. That's one of things I like about ya.


    28. #26
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      Re: (Steely)

      Quote, originally posted by Steely »
      I personally would pay upwards of 50% of my income in taxes if it would raise the standard of living in the US to that of, say...Norway, Sweden or Switzerland.

      funny anecdote: I was in Norway a couple of years ago, and an elderly relative there was moaning about "richest country in the world and we can't even fix a damned pothole"

      as you can imagine, with all the frost Norway gets, it's tough to keep up with the potholes. And Ingvar was pretty convinced the country wasn't even trying.

      ps Big Mac? $10 in Norway.

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    29. #27
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      Re: (ADP1)

      I'd be more interested in what folks that live there have to say sbout the state of healthcare and longevity in Scandanavia.


    30. #28
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      Re: (Steely)

      Quote, originally posted by Steely »
      I'd be more interested in what folks that live there have to say sbout the state of healthcare and longevity in Scandanavia.

      I didn't talk to folks about that, much. They all seemed to want to know how we could have been dumb enough to elect Bush. The old timers even said, we couldn't beleive you were dumb enough to elect Reagan, but then you went and proved it AGAIN by voting for Bush. (I was there before Bush-Kerry) So I statyed away from discussions of any topics that could end up leading down a political road, which in a (semi-)Socialist state, that means you can't discuss ANYTHING!!

      My experience (with most issues) is that people only know their OWN health system, so their stories don't really tell you anything vis a vis a comparison to other health systems. Hell, MY health experiences don't tell us anything about YOUR health experiences.

      Norwegians DO drink and drive less, that's for sure.

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      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit (2k2S80t6)

      Quote, originally posted by 2k2S80t6 »
      Well, it's an easy fix. the Dems with win the white house in 2008. With control of the legislative and executive branches they will run wild raising taxes to never before seen levels to fund a debt pay down (so they can say they fixed our problems) and socialized healthcare and other welfare programs. We will look more an more like Canada every day. Our military will be emasculated as well.

      You can't give away everything to those whom don't need it and not run up a huge tab. Talk about a lack of insight always living for the present and not looking to the future. The same problem most americans have, never saving any money for the future!

      Who is responsibe for the debt Crisis?

      IMHO Reagan, Bush and Bush


    32. #30
      Senior Member 2k2S80t6's Avatar
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      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit (SurfOnline)

      Is that corrected for inflation or any other adjustements like wartime?

    33. #31
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      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit (2k2S80t6)

      Quote, originally posted by 2k2S80t6 »
      Is that corrected for inflation or any other adjustements like wartime?

      The value of the deficit changes along with the dollar, and it is continuous, it has never been paid off.

      Also, the value of the dollar doesn't change during times of war.

      This is about the deficit. If you go off to war, you have to pay for with taxes or decreases in other spending. Reagan had a good economy by deregulation and subsidizing the economy with outrageous defense spending. Both came back to bite us on the ass.

      Clinton had an even better economy by raising taxes on the rich and balancing the budget. He also generated a surplus for a couple of years and paid down some of the debt. And since he threatened to veto any bill that didn't lead to a balanced budget, he does get some credit.

      Bush never vetoed anything except stem cell research that could have helped millions of people and the human race in general. But tax cuts for the rich and pork spending for republicans in congress while invading and occupying another country that had never attacked the US and posed no imminent danger to anyone? NO PROBLEM.

      Worst president EVER, and possibly just, evil.


    34. #32
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      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit ("R" Kelly)

      Quote, originally posted by "R" Kelly »

      The value of the deficit changes along with the dollar, and it is continuous, it has never been paid off.

      Also, the value of the dollar doesn't change during times of war.

      This is about the deficit. If you go off to war, you have to pay for with taxes or decreases in other spending.

      Right on R.

      Is that the best that a Bush apologist can do.......inflation adjusted?

      A deficit is a deficit. Plain and simple.

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    35. #33
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      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit ("R" Kelly)

      Quote, originally posted by "R" Kelly »

      Also, the value of the dollar doesn't change during times of war.

      Currencies can change dramatically AFTER a war. Case in point: Post WWI Germany. But then there were international embargos, and steep war reparations to pay, so the gov't just printed endless piles of Deutsche Marks.

      I don't think our invasion of the oil fields of Iraq will lead to the same end for the US, but we will have to pay for the war in higher taxes at some time, or by printing tons of green-backs.

      Quote, originally posted by "R" Kelly »

      Worst president EVER...

      The bar was set high by Coolidge and Grant, but I'll give this one to you! Just for kicks, I did a google search for the words: "Worst president ever" and look at what came up as the third choice!!!

      Google Search for worst president

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    36. #34
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      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit ("R" Kelly)

      Dude... R-Kelly... The Daily Show picked up on that Lehrer interview w/ Bush that you referred to... it's on the show right now, perhaps it'll be on youtube later.

      Again, nice find, sir.

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    37. #35
      Senior Member R Kelly's Avatar
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      Lyon, France
      Posts
      18,762

      Re: Bernanke warns of looming danger in budget deficit (24Hours)

      Quote, originally posted by 24Hours »
      Dude... R-Kelly... The Daily Show picked up on that Lehrer interview w/ Bush that you referred to... it's on the show right now, perhaps it'll be on youtube later.

      Again, nice find, sir.

      Thanks, but you're mixing posts, screwing with my head.

      https://forums.swedespeed.com/z...01663

      I can't believe I missed it, was watching Tennis... will catch it on YouTube or VideoOnDemand.


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