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No more free software updates

18K views 130 replies 49 participants last post by  generic_volvo_driver 
#1 · (Edited)
Sorry to say but Volvo has decided to stop reimbursing dealerships for updating software during services. This means no more free software. HOWEVER, each dealership is different and may still do it (at the cost of the technicians time AKA free) but I highly doubt it. Nobody works for free :thumbdown:

After careful analysis VCUSA has determined there has not been adequate upside to service retention

or customer satisfaction as a result of this goodwill. To date, less than half of the cars eligible for the upgrade are

getting it. In addition, we will be removing Complimentary Software updates from our suite of customer

promises under the Service by Volvo umbrella. Effective August 1, 2019 Volvo Car USA will cease labor

reimbursement associated with the complimentary Service 2.0 software update.


Do NOT ASK ME WHY.... I DO NOT KNOW ANYTHING ELSE!!

I recommend writing Volvo Cars USA and express your concern/anger/disappointment as I feel the same as you
 
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#43 ·
Software 2.0 updates should NEVER be charged for the software itself. HOWEVER... we do not work for free and if Volvo was paying us 1/2 hour to do software, the customer or dealer should be paying us techs the same. The risk on SW failures and the aftermath of a failure is the reason I will never do "free" software.

I literally just lost 5 hours (minimum) of paid hours a week and if customers, dealers, and Volvo think I will just eat this with a smile, they are mistaken :mad:
Then you need to find another reputable dealer. Dealer should pay you regardless of what Volvo policy is. If that isn't possible where you are I'd go work for a different company because that would be way unfair. My gen manager would never not pay his techs for their work regardless.
 
#44 ·
Then you need to find another reputable dealer. Dealer should pay you regardless of what Volvo policy is. If that isn't possible where you are I'd go work for a different company because that would be way unfair.
If you find one in America, let me know. Its unheard of but you may know better than us technicians.

BTW, i work for a fanstastic dealer. Best one I worked for in the US.
 
#47 · (Edited)
I was at my dealer yesterday having the trunk strut recall completed. They had just gotten word from Volvo about the change, and their gut reaction was to continue to offer it to there customers for free.

That said, I think this change would pretty clearly be a breach of contract by Volvo to customers that have already purchased their vehicles. Just sitting in the waiting room I saw the below sign as well as the wording on my dealer's website about free software upgrades for life. I will be sending a letter to Volvo reminding them of their commitment to me when I purchased the car.

 
#50 ·
Software 2.0 updates should NEVER be charged for the software itself. HOWEVER... we do not work for free and if Volvo was paying us 1/2 hour to do software, the customer or dealer should be paying us techs the same. The risk on SW failures and the aftermath of a failure is the reason I will never do "free" software.

I literally just lost 5 hours (minimum) of paid hours a week and if customers, dealers, and Volvo think I will just eat this with a smile, they are mistaken :mad:
No and I mean no one should work for free at any job.

That being said, some people could mes-represent their statement and make it look as someone else should be the escape goat for this.

Let me tell you what I think and I believe many if not all believe the same.

We are only releasing pressure in ways that might seem inaccurate, but what everyone here wants is for Volvo to honor their deal that they've extended to current owners by:
1)reimbursing in full the dealers -> Techs for such jobs.
2)provide these jobs as promised for free to the customers.

Trust me when I tell you. These costs were already considered when they priced their cars to the market.

So at the end I believe we "customers and techs" should stand together and support each other in holding them to their words.

*And I genuinely believe that this is what Gunshow and Tech are trying to advocate by sharing all what they are sharing with us.*

Thank you guys for helping us and for being you.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
#52 ·
Software 2.0 updates should NEVER be charged for the software itself. HOWEVER... we do not work for free and if Volvo was paying us 1/2 hour to do software, the customer or dealer should be paying us techs the same. The risk on SW failures and the aftermath of a failure is the reason I will never do "free" software.

I literally just lost 5 hours (minimum) of paid hours a week and if customers, dealers, and Volvo think I will just eat this with a smile, they are mistaken
No and I mean no one should work for free at any job.

That being said, some people could mes-represent their statement and make it look as someone else should be the escape goat for this.

Let me tell you what I think and I believe many if not all believe the same.

We are only releasing pressure in ways that might seem inaccurate, but what everyone here wants is for Volvo to honor their deal that they've extended to current owners by:
1)reimbursing in full the dealers -> Techs for such jobs.
2)provide these jobs as promised for free to the customers.

Trust me when I tell you. These costs were already considered when they priced their cars to the market.

So at the end I believe we "customers and techs" should stand together and support each other in holding them to their words.

*And I genuinely believe that this is what Gunshow and Tech are trying to advocate by sharing all what they are sharing with us.*

Thank you guys for helping us and for being you.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Yes I agree.

I stand up for Volvo and dealers a lot here in the face of many peoples' hatred for the "stealership". But I do not agree with what Volvo is doing here, unless they are planning to release yearly Service Actions for Total Upgrades.
 
#56 ·
I have the impression that all this is specific to the US market and not a worldwide issue. I am not aware how technicians are being paid in the US, but I assume from Gunshow that they are being paid by the hour they work on a vehicle, which means that they are accounted for any time they perform a work and they also have restrictions on how much time they can do such works. In Greece on the other hand technicians are paid on a monthly basis 5 or 6 day a week from 08.00 to 16.30. In this timespan they are supposed to perform all works and services for the cars scheduled for the day. That means that whether they spent half an hour or 5 hours on one vehicle updating its software, their salary will not change. The only problem that might arise is that some customers might have to wait longer to take back their vehicles. Having said all that, I also have to mention that on my car they have had to do total module update twice, a process that took around two hours each time BUT all this time I did not see the technician on top of my car the whole time. The only thing I noticed was the cable connected to the computer and the car plugged in doing noises and flashing different lights.

My point is that this announcement from Volvo Cars USA most probably has to do with their relationship with the dealers and not the customers.
 
#58 ·
I have the impression that all this is specific to the US market and not a worldwide issue. I am not aware how technicians are being paid in the US, but I assume from Gunshow that they are being paid by the hour they work on a vehicle, which means that they are accounted for any time they perform a work and they also have restrictions on how much time they can do such works. In Greece on the other hand technicians are paid on a monthly basis 5 or 6 day a week from 08.00 to 16.30. In this timespan they are supposed to perform all works and services for the cars scheduled for the day. That means that whether they spent half an hour or 5 hours on one vehicle updating its software, their salary will not change. The only problem that might arise is that some customers might have to wait longer to take back their vehicles
Techs in the US (at most dealerships) are paid flat rate. We are paid an amount of time per job based on labor time guides.

For example, a timing belt on a P2 pays 2.5 hours. I can do the job in under 40 minutes. I am still paid 2.5 hours.

As gunshow said, the piston jobs pay around 11 hours warranty. It may take 16 hours. We are still paid 11 hours.

At the end of a 40 hour week, I might have 50 or 60 hours. I might also have 30. Some shops have a guarantee of a certain number of hours per week. So if guarantee is 35 hours and I have 30, I am paid 35. If I have 60, I am paid 60.

So any job that we are doing that we are not being paid for is a waste of time. That is why if my dealer does not pay me internally for software updates, I will not be tying up one of my work bays doing software updates.
 
#59 ·
Correct me if I am wrong, but there is no physical labor involved in software update. A technician just plugs VIDA machine in the car, punches a couple of keys and the computer does all the work. I just don't see how it would be appropriate to compare the effort required to something like an engine rebuild or even an oil change. Software updates should be part of normal development costs for the car maker, similar to voluntary recall due to a defective/malfunctioning part. To charge a customer for this is a rip off, plain and simple (including Polestar "optimization"). Flame on :D
 
#60 ·
Correct me if I am wrong, but there is no physical labor involved in software update. A technician just plugs VIDA machine in the car, punches a couple of keys and the computer does all the work. I just don't see how it would be appropriate to compare the effort required to something like an engine rebuild or even an oil change. Software updates should be part of normal development costs for the car maker, similar to voluntary recall due to a defective/malfunctioning part. To charge a customer for this is a rip off, plain and simple (including Polestar "optimization"). Flame on
It's about time, not effort. Minimal effort is needed if all goes smoothly. But the car is tying up my work bay, so I can't use that bay to make money if I'm downloading free software. I also can't use my VIDA to diagnose another car of someone who is paying for my time.
 
#68 ·
No offense taken. Just don't get mad at the techs for not doing your update when you bring the car in. Them not getting paid isn't your problem or your fault. But that doesn't mean they should do it for free either out of the goodness of their heart.
 
#71 ·
If your car comes in under warranty for a problem that can be fixed with software, you get software and we get paid. So that is not an issue.

I hope they re-evaluate it as well. But if they don't and my dealer doesn't pay me, then I'm not doing them.
 
#73 ·
Rather than figure out why their goodwill attempt failed, Volvo USA executives decide its better to penalize those customers who A) never knew, B) were specifically told there was no free upgrade by their Volvo dealer, C) live too far from the sparse dealer locations around the country, or D) don’t feel they can trust their Volvo dealer that anything they do will actually be free.
 
#76 ·
Took my car in for its 20,000 mile service today at Galpin Volvo in Van Nuys and as expected did not receive a complimentary software update.

Called Volvo Customer Care and they confirmed the change in policy, all that they said that they could do for me is send me the 30% off rebate form that has been mentioned in the past.

My questions for the techs on this board is what happens when a customer purchases a software accessory such as Polestar or even just the trailer module software?

Do these packages require the latest software update?

If so, will the cost of these packages increase as well?
 
#92 ·
Took my car in for its 20,000 mile service today at Galpin Volvo in Van Nuys and as expected did not receive a complimentary software update.
At that point I'm looking for a dealer than will, or trading in my car for another brand! Seriously. This is 100% unacceptable to me for this brand as a consumer. I don't care what anyone else is doing or quite frankly what the techs situation is. For me this is where I would draw the line. Sometimes in life you have to take a stand. It is an idiotic move, period!
 
#81 ·
There are updates between the bi-annual ones. So far, the May and November ones have been there ones where customers will notice something different. But there have absolutely been updates between them.

Accessories like Polestar can still be installed. It will update the appropriate modules.
 
#90 · (Edited)
My Volvo was in service yesterday, it was the 90k service, the software-updates are still free in Belgium.

More info:
It is Operation ID 17415

https://www.volvocars.com/nl-be/naverkoop/uw-volvo/onderhoud-en-reparatie

"The most worry-free way to own a car
There are even more ways we want to make your life easier.

Every time you bring in your Volvo for maintenance, we carry out a complete maintenance package, which we call Volvo Service 2.0.
You can count on free software updates (which will make your Volvo a little better with every maintenance) and a health check with battery check for your car. After servicing, your Volvo Assistance breakdown assistance will be extended free of charge by one year.

A personal contact person is always at your disposal, for questions or if, for example, you want to use replacement transport."
 
#91 · (Edited by Moderator)
This is the first I've heard of this and it's very sad to hear. I saw the free software updates as a big plus and one that actually led to me keeping my Volvo (I had serious transmission shift issues) and adding another for my wife. Unfortunately, despite having only 54k on my XC60 that I bought new, I continue to have problems with the transmission and engine mounts. Volvo replaced the transmission around the 21k mark all but 1 engine mount at 45k miles and already the idle vibration is back with the A/C on. My car is out of warranty now and still has crappy shift quality (my wifes car is the same). My Volvo will be paid off in 2 months and my wife's soon after. We plan to keep our Volvos for a while but the cars are already starting to feel old despite only having 54k and 76k respectively. They feel about the same as my 135k mile Scion that I actually used for racing. The Volvos have been treated very well by comparison. Volvo quality seems to be going down hill and it's very sad to see. Unfortunately I will likely end up with a Lexus or Acura for my next purchase. Losing free software updates along with the crappy Volvo dealer experience in my area only solidify my decision.

On a side note, as someone who worked as certified technician and has run a quality assurance program for over 10 years, I'm quite surprised that auto dealers still pay technicians by the book hour. Every other similar industry pays worker either by the clock hour or on salary. If auto techs got paid for every hour they were clocked in, or were on salary, this conversation about doing work "on my time" would cease to be an issue. Also, when I was a technician, I went above and beyond my responsibilities as a service to my customers and employer and it was one of main reasons I was able to rise quickly into management. Not taking shots at those auto techs that posted in this thread, it's just the idea of pay by book hours has upset me for years. It adds needless complication to accounting functions while doing little to enhance dealer performance. I know that small/slow dealers like book hours because they can have technicians on site for 12 hours and only pay them for 6 or 7. There seems to be no advantage to the larger dealers. IMO, technicians should be pushing for hourly or salary pay schedules.
 
#93 · (Edited)
On a side note, as someone who worked as certified technician and has run a quality assurance program for over 10 years, I'm quite surprised that auto dealers still pay technicians by the book hour. Every other similar industry pays worker either by the clock hour or on salary. If auto techs got paid for every hour they were clocked in, or were on salary, this conversation about doing work "on my time" would cease to be an issue. Also, when I was a technician, I went above and beyond my responsibilities as a service to my customers and employer and it was one of main reasons I was able to rise quickly into management. Not taking shots at those auto techs that posted in this thread, it's just the idea of pay by book hours has upset me for years. It adds needless complication to accounting functions while doing little to enhance dealer performance. I know that small/slow dealers like book hours because they can have technicians on site for 12 hours and only pay them for 6 or 7. There seems to be no advantage to the larger dealers. IMO, technicians should be pushing for hourly or salary pay schedules.
Dealers don't want us booking 7 hours in 12 hours of time.

They want their service bays producing for them. They want us booking 12 in an 8 hour day. They may charge $150 an hour and pay the tech $25 of that. They want us to book as many hours as possible.

I do not go above and beyond because if I give them an inch, they take a mile. They always try the "but it will just take a minute" excuse. Add 15 things that just take a minute and it adds up.

Inspecting a car just takes a minute.
Changing license plates just takes a minute.
Replacing wipers just takes a minute.
Free battery checks just take a minute (far from it).
Replacing city stickers or inspection stickers just takes a minute.
Checking and topping off fluids just takes a minute.
Tire pressure checks just take a minute.
Etc...

These add up.

I'm not asking for sympathy. But don't get mad at me for not doing a free update for free.

I'm all for a fair salary. I would love to not have to worry about what I will book this week. But my idea of a fair salary is sure to differ from management. And their fear is if I am salary, I will work slower. For me personally, that is not true. But I know guys who absolutely would.
 
#94 ·
There are a lot of pay structures between straight commission and salary, I've dealt with that my entire career. They could give you a base salary with production incentives for example.

The reason I say this is that fundamentally your dealership is a sales organization, even if most of the profits don't come from sales. Very often in sales one must think of the long run customer satisfaction. I am a small business and work exclusively on commission. I do things for my customers ALL THE TIME that are "above and beyond" because I know that in the long run I will be more than compensated by increased sales from customer loyalty. A dealership that lets the service department dictate how the customer is treated without regard to the impact on customer satisfaction is a dealership that has lost its way, imo.

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#95 ·
Right. But I'm not the owner of the dealer. Dealers can decide to update software for free. If mine decides that, given my pay structure, I expect to be paid. It's up to the dealer to go above and beyond. They are the ones who (through Volvo's marketing) made the free software promise.
 
#96 ·
I've been reading this post on and off today. Some members have made some great points on the lack of quality of the new Volvos, due to materials etc. Geely nickel & diming owners in lieu return customers.
The whole software thing is disturbing considering all the problems I've read and what could go wrong. 14XC606A comments (post #91) just about put the nail in the coffin for me and another Volvo. I was thinking about and OSD for a new XC40 (RMD's kicking in now- throwing that in cause most of you folks use acronyms like everybody knows them-annoying) to replace the C70 next year. No way- I'm leaving Volvo- won't do it. My S40 is running perfect with 75k on it and always has. But from here on out- no Volvos for me and I have to admit the software thing helped me decide real quick. Although I have a great dealer who I know would probably work with me, I'm still calling it quits. They lost me and I'm just one. More will follow I am sure. And I am going to write Volvo telling them that.
 
#99 ·
I was in my local Volvo dealer this week (Toronto area) and their sign is still up listing complimentary software updates with your annual maintenance. I asked to clarify given the recent announcement and they said they would continue to offer this service.
 
#101 ·
I just had my car in for service (engine lite on, o2 sensor) and they did a software update even though when I scheduled the service they told me there wasn't a new one out. I can tell because instead of sport mode (or whatever it used to be called) it's now called Polestar something or other.
 
#102 ·
Just returned from the dealership. There are only 2 in my state. The one near me said free updates ended 8/1/19. They charge $95 all in. Said it takes about an hour.

Haven’t checked with the other dealership yet.

The service advisor explained it to me this way: “It’s like your iPhone... you can choose to update to the latest version but your phone works fine the way it is. If you want the new features, there’s charge for that.”

Either that explanation somehow made sense to him or he’s been coached. I replied... “Yea, I guess, except I don’t have to play to update my iPhone. Apple WANTS to provide new features as an incentive to stick with their offerings.”

I got a shoulder shrug out of that.

From the tech’s perspective, I totally get no wanting to do it for free and I wouldn’t ask that either. This is definitely a ball-drop by Volvo IMO.


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